its a data science portal for HASS that is only released as an addon.
and i think its a very bad sign if there are things created for home assistant that are not usable for not hassio users.
hassio is build for the less experienced users that are less able to program.
hass is grown because of the more experienced users that are able to program.
and a lot of those users dont use hassio, but they are the most important part from this community.
as soon as those people feel excluded, or forced into an environment like hassio which restricts them, they will look elsewhere and stop supporting hass.
and without the community hass isnt halve as great as it is.
i can expect and accept when third parties build and offer new functions to hassio, that are not available to people without hassio, but i really hope that the hass devs will stay far away from that, because it will destroy hass.
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@ajfriesen I get that it’s for HASS.io and that’s why I asked.
I just think it’s uncool to announce a new feature that everyone could use and limit it to just a HASS.io add-on. I’ve never heard of this and a few key pointers to get it setup would go a long way.
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right, there should not be anything in the docs from home assistant that is exclusively usable by hassio users.
i dont even expect a complete guide how to install juypter, but i think the guide from HA should say which parts need to be done yourself (preferably with some links) and then which parts of the guide are usefull for none hassio users.
for many components that is simular ( a link to some webpage or even a guide how to setup webservices and even parts that need to be installed sometimes)
edit: by the way noone should think that i ask shout out for this for myself. i dont use the database from HA because i think it saves to much and is setup completely wrong thats why it grows big very fast.
but i am really concerned about the way this is going, because i love HASS and i would love to see it get really great, and a fear the worst when i see stuff like this.
I dont think its a bad sign, not yet, if yes it stays just a hassio platform and other items do start following that excludes some of us, then yes we can feel upset.
Also found more information on the hass detective
I think there is some confusion here. You can install the HASS-data-detective on any platform as its just a python package, i’m actually running it on my Mac. The Hassio addon is for Jupyterlab, but likewise you can install and use Jupyterlab on any platform also. Please refer to the Jupyterlab docs for instructions for your platform. You can create the env the addon uses by installing these requirements.
Cheers
I agree with all the upset people in the thread, especially the comment that it should be the other way round. Build something for Homeassistant, then make an addon so it can be easily integrated into hassio.
Some of the core promises that were made about this project not becoming reliant on addons and always being able to be dealt with in code seem to be being eroded, and it is a very sad time IMO.
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Thank you @robmarkcole and everyone else involved.
The hassio addon is just a convenience for people who use hassio, you are by no means required to use it to benefit from the portal/python package.
Can we look forward to your instructions being posted to the official docs soon then @cgtobi ?
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Not sure if that isn’t too specific but I’ll take a look.
@stanvx Congrats you found the first bug 
I think what would calm everyone’s fears (and I had the same thoughts when I read the blog post) is just to include a line mentioning that non-hassio users can install the parts separately. Or even better, start off the sentence with that, and end it with “and for hassio users we’ve created this addon”. Just my 2 cents 
i found that out when i did see your git rob.
the confusion comes because they lauched a doc that clearly states it expects hassio installed.
if i read your readme i see that it can be installed with pip also.
ir would have been very easy to make the docs so that its not only for hassio, but for all users.
and thats what worries me.
in the quick start it says:
This guide is assuming that you have a Hass.io installation up and running
from that moment on i dont know which part from the docs might be usable for other systems and which parts from the docs are specific for hassio.
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Well, the quick start guide is exactly that, a quick start guide. It is the fastest way to get you going. If you don’t use hass.io you usually are a more experienced user and know how to set up things like jupyter. But I agree that it should be made more excplicit that you don’t have to use hass.io.
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the whole quick start is for hassio users only. so how do i know if anything else in the docs is usefull for none hassio users?
if it is a home assistant doc it should at least have pointers to how to for others. off course an experienced user can start googling for jupyter, then find that site, find out how to install it and use it, and then find a way to use it with home assistant data.
an experienced home assistant user can do completely without the home assistant docs if needed. but he shouldnt!
Ditto exactly what @ReneTode said 
Would be glad to play with it and get some insights from it, running HASS using the official docker image
+1 - pls include also for non-hassio users
I wish people would calm down instead of right away jumping to blaming the Home Assistant devs of destroying Home Assistant 
It looks like it has been misunderstood, and so let me clarify: when we mention “data science portal”, we actually are talking about the new data website, which describes all the data that Home Assistant stores in detail and how you can query it.
Here is the definition of a portal by Google:
We have also made a JupyterLab notebook available that will help you explore your own data. Home Assistant itself does not contain a data science environment, so this notebook requires you to have JupyterLab installed.
For non Hass.io users, you are yourself responsible for installing applications on your system. You will need to figure out yourself how to install JupyterLab. After you do, you can use the same data science tools and notebooks as Hass.io users described in the quick start guide.
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Possibly you should wonder to yourself “Why does this keep happening?”, the answer may surprise you.
Not long ago this paragraph from you would have been “To do this on homeassistant, do XYZ. Hassio users can use an addon”. But nowadays it is “You’re not on hassio so work it out yourself”. This is the answer to what you should have been wondering.
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I was just trying to help you understand why people are getting upset, but if you don’t think they are then that’s fine. It’s your project
Awesome. Looks pretty great, and almost no issues following the quick start guide.
The stumbling blocks I ran in to that could slow down installation:
)
help(db_from_hass_config) gave me enough info to set the config path.
. Including a link to the relevant SQLAlchemy docs listing supported dialects and the required modules might be helpful.
i am sorry balloob, but isnt this exactly what i am saying?
you lauch a website for hassio users, tell none hassio users to figure things out themselves and from the website itself there is no way to tell which parts can be usefull for not hassio users.
i dont even want to use it, and i feel why this upsets people.
and it upsets people that you call your army, the ones that you need to make HA great and keep HA more alive then other programs.
and even if it is wrong that those people get upset, you should hear them why they are upset and see if it is possible to fix their feelings instead of just telling them to go figure it out themselves.
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which part is incorrect? i didnt talk about how it is now but about the time it was lauched.
its still a concern because the reaction to the upset people was: “go figure it out yourselve” instead of:
“he we did see that we missed something, but we took care of it and added it to the docs”
my concern is that it will happen again if there is no awareness for that problem (that it upsets none hassio users if they feel left out)
and every time it happens again, the risk is that some great people from this community that keep the community alive, turn their back to the community.
and if balloob only reads from that, that i say that devs are killing HA, then he should read it again.
i say that it will kill HA if there is not enough concern for those who make HA great (and believe me allthough i am here on the forum daily and helping out in some areas, i am absolutely not talking about myself)
Reported, Thanks
Hi guys,
a possibly stupid question from my side: what is the advantage of this solution against InfluxDB+Grafana?
I see you do not need to duplicate your Database and rely on a single source (HA DB) but…I see a lot of advantages to keep a light and quick DB for HA (keeping like 7-10days of data recorded) and a separate DB for long terms statistics.
I am sure I am missing the point so can someone explain what are the practical advantages of this solution?
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Nice work done by the developers!
What i don’t understand, why the devs put a lot effort to create a Hassio addon, who’s targeted audience normally are the less ICT skilled people, to make home assistant and all its features accessible for those users. I have looked at this packages and come to the conclusion that this doesn’t fit the target audience of Hass IO, but more the people that have more ICT skills. I would be more logical to provide a more detailed guide to use these tools without Hass-io, so I understand the feeling of some users, but hey we are clever enough to figure it out by ourselves and then share it with this community. The tools that are provided here and the underlying python data analyses capabilities are tools that are used by professional datanalists/datascience people. The Jupyter notebooks are really great and reminds me of my earlier experience (20 yrs ago) I had with mathlab, where graphs/code/expressions could mixed up in documents. This is great for people who understand the content, but not so great for people who are just interested in the results (graphs). I must agree with @mspinolo that for the ordinary end-user, Grafana a more compelling interface is for Hass IO end users, who are interested in beautiful dashboards. The best of both worlds would be, do analytics and data mashups with python data tools and present the results on a Grafana dashboard. A lot of easier tasks/analytics can probably also be done in Grafana without python.
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With the add-on, an (aspiring) data scientist can get his data science tools ready to use with 1 click compared to having to figure out how it works on his system, how to connect to HA etc. What do you think will get more people to try it? What do you think will get more people actively developing new algorithms and contributing them back to HA? Right, it’s the one click that makes the tools available.
For the people in this thread, try re-reading all your comments and knowing that the people you’re attacking, volunteered their spare time and resources to built this. They spend their time to make a platform to allow data scientists to help with the development of Home Assistant. They didn’t get paid to do it, they did it because they believe in our mission of creating an independent home automation alternative that focuses on local control and privacy.
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i reread all the reactions 3 times more and i can only come to the conclusion that you feel attacked by me.
and i am sorry about that because that was not my intention.
all i did was try to speak out some concerns, just exactly because i have the respect for those who build HA in their spare time. and i hoped to help avoid upset people in the future.
so again sorry if some people feel attacked by my postings, that really was not my intention.
i hope you reread my postings without feeling attacked and see what i want to say.
i guess i can add nothing more then this excuse, so i leave it by that.
Deploying Hassio today literally saved me hours of mucking about with Nginx, Duck DNS, lets encrypt and all that other nonsense. I was up and running on my otherwise bare metal Ubuntu 18.04 in no time. Docker is awesome, and so is Hassio. Thumbs up to the devs.
Nobody is attacking anybody, people are asking valid questions. The reason they are so upset is because they are just as passionate about this project as you are.
The fact that some of us can’t write a new component doesn’t stop us dedicating hours and hours of our lives to this project in other ways.
Wow the whining in this thread is unreal. When a new feature is released, why wouldn’t it make sense to design it (and the docs) first for a common install base?
Secondly, more than one person has said they think the focus on Hass.io for new features is disturbing or “concerning” and they imply that if the devs focus on hass.io the project is doomed. Seriously? Do you hear yourself? Hass.io is the very opposite. It ensures broad accessibility and I would wager has brought — and kept — more people in the fold than any other one thing. Anecdotally, I know dozens of people who wouldn’t have touched Hass before Hass.io — not because they’re dumb but because they don’t have the time to fiddle with things to the degree necessary without Hass.io.
I’ve done various install methods and have used HA since about version 0.15 I think. And I too now use Hass.io. It’s the future of this platform and it will enable devs to support the broadest possible user base and focus on higher level features rather than dealing with lots of low level environment-specific issues. Sorry if that means those of you running custom installs lag a bit on some features, or have to gasp wait a bit for more specific docs to guide you, but that’s just reality if you’re using a non-standard setup.
To @balloob, @frenck, @robmarkcole and others who work so hard on all this stuff…thank you. Your efforts are appreciated.
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that is never implied by anyone.
i think hassio is great for people who dont have skills or time to develope things theirselve. and it makes using it easy and thats great.
but i think that most of the people who use it are not the ones that develope new components, or repair components when something changes.
i might be wrong, but i think that the most people that use HA without hassio are the ones that are on the list of hundreds of people who contributed to HA.
we need those people.
its great that those people can use HA now also, but those are not the people we can rely on to expand and maintain HA in the future.
i can only second that.
I’m an happy Hassio user and I’m excited by the idea to do some deep analytics (not only monitoring by Grafana) on my HA data. Unfortunately, from yesterday, I’ trying to install the add-on but I’m continuing to take the following error:
ERROR (SyncWorker_8) [hassio.docker.interface] Can’t install hassioaddons/jupyterlablite:0.1.0 -> 404 Client Error: Not Found (“no such image: hassioaddons/jupyterlablite:0.1.0: No such image: hassioaddons/jupyterlablite:0.1.0”).
I’m using Pine64 with Dietpi OS. HA 0.84.6 and Hassio supervisor is 141.
I really appreciate your help to fix the problem. Thank you very much in advance
ADDED INFO:
I tried to pull manually the image with the command:
and I obtain the following message:
You’ll be pleased to know that this thread serves a purpose. It is being used by the Linus Torvalds School Of Management to demonstrate how to become tone-deaf to users’ concerns.
/s
Well, it seems again that there are a lot of assumptions.
Let me clarify a couple of things about the new Data Science Portal. We provide Jupyter notebooks to interact with Home Assistant’s data for quite a while now. They can be used in multiple ways and give the users several possibilities to work with their data. The drawbacks of the standalone notebook approach was it didn’t work well with Hass.io or ARM-based device and required a lot of manual setup to get the data in an useful form.
The new add-on and HASS-Data-Detective are simplify the whole process and make the analysis of the data more approachable.
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Again? No no no, this has never happened before 
I can’t believe that bullshit. In what way does that show the project falling apart? Releasing this as a addon for Hass.io makes things more accessible nothing more nothing less. It is just a quick way to get started. People who have a more advanced or custom setup already know how to set up those kind of things. This comment is nothing but ridiculous.
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This feels like people who opted to not use the more One click-approach of hassio gets angry that this isn’t an one click solution for them. Almost everything that’s avaliable for hassio is also available for the other install methods, you just have to do it yourself. That’s what you chose.
This IS the great thing about hassio for many people, that addons help people do things they otherwise would have trouble accomplishing themselves.
Incorrect.
That’s fine, but that’s not how the original blog post was written. The original blog post was written implied that in order to use this with homeassistant you needed to use a specially written hassio addon. That’s why people were upset. The blog has since been edited to show that you can use it with the other tools, and tells you what tools you need. This is fine. People remain upset because of how the post initially ignored a massive percentage of the user base and that portion of people were basically told to “jog on and work it out for yourselves” which is a HUGE paradigm shift for the community spirit of this project.
I don’t think this was ever in dispute. But there are also a large middle ground of people who are technically articulate enough to want the flexibility of a non-hassio install, but don’t understand the complexities of communicating with homeassistant, and just want a few pointers in the right direction (and not to be forgotten about)
You can explore the data that resembles your HASS instance to gather information about how to build automations and such.
@balloob It’s seams that it is a handful of people screaming their ass of in this case. Way is hard to understand, maybe jealousy 
However, they represent some 0,001% of all users, don’t let them get to you guys. You are doing a awesome job and we are many people that rely appreciate your hard work!
For those how don’t like it, welcome to contribute instead of complaining. HA is not a right, it’s a service!
Even better, you can actually try out the detective library on Binderhub. You can even upload your own .db if you want and do analysis on it. Try the Usage of detective.ipynb notebook. This is basically the ‘minimal effort’ experience you get with the addon. Cheers
My original use case was for optimising a Bayesian sensor - determining inputs and priors to get the right behaviour from the sensor. Other use cases include creating ML models for classification or regression. The options are many
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I understand and support @ReneTode concerns. Home Assistant appears to be taking a new direction, and of course that’s worrying to those who took to the original concept, and those who have built their home around it. HA wasn’t advertised to the average user, and that gave maximum flexibility. That uniqueness is without doubt fading, and it’s proabably no coincidence that it started to occur when the financial backing came along. One can only hope that the project continues to believe in the original concept and those who have contributed so much. This new feature probably doesn’t warrant my comments as I admire seeing new features regardless, but I can’t help but support loyal servants to the project such as @ReneTode when I sympathise with their concerns. Let’s not forget those who have helped take the project this far.
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I’ve read this thread from the beginning three times I still can’t understand the reason for this controversy. Maybe I’m just dumb (which is probably true), but I really can not see a reason for all this.
Sorry have to disagree, if anything the “financial backing” has allowed the project to accelerate.
Every project need to evolve and if necessary take new directions to stay relevant, that is good management.
Every now and again, a feature or change is introduced and some people take exception to it,
Ubiquiti Networks investment in baloob - will take HA from being open source was the cry, yet still open source
HA cloud - not in original spirit of project was the call out, yet its helped lots of people and will help all in the long run with allowing the project to take on full time developers
Hass.io released- will other methods not be supported was the criticism. yet they still are.
Even with all the criticism the developers still choose to keep going forward and at a cracking pace. Just because a feature is released with documentation for one platform does not mean the end of HA for the rest of us who choose anther installation method.
So people calm down and move on,
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I have some suggestions for the Data Science Portal that I hope would help new users. First, as a non-Data Scientist, it would be great if you could add a definition of “Data Science” on the home page. Next, I’d recommend showing some examples of what can be accomplished to help convince a potential user why it’s worth looking at. Lastly, I think, a couple of walk through examples would be beneficial.
This will come over time. People who make use of it will share their experience so other can learn from it.
To me the data science portal and how it has been released fits well in the style of Home Assistant as a whole. It is released early so that curious people can give it a go and the documentation will grow over time.
All in all, some critics here might have a point but the energy put into all the ranting would be much better spent by contributing to the project as in threads like this.
Appealing to less technical users, because there’s more of them.
All of the points you made are 100% valid, however I think the only criticism that is warranted is that the project has far outpaced the documentation. I’d venture a guess that 50% of the threads on this forum are for issues that could have been answered by the users themselves with better documentation.
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I think that a failing of any fast paced project
But it does go both ways, the documentation can be updated by anyone.
Hence why this thread went south so quickly. The blog post says: " All of this is powered by the new JupyterLab hass.io add-on" and then we clicked the link, and the guide implied that this was the only way to do it.
Turns out it was an ommision in the linked doc, and it has been rectified, but I think the strength of feeling that this core promise had been broken is evident from the emotions in this thread, and are not helped when the ‘big cheese’ enters the fray and says things like “go and work it out yourself” which further reinforces the fear that other methods won’t be supported in future.
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It has nothing to do with this component or how it was released. That is irrelevant.
As @anon43302295 has pointed out it has to do with the interaction between the founder, the developers, and the user community. Lots of anger, frustration, resentment, and general unhappiness in all related parties.
That is what leads to people eventually saying “fu@k it” and moving on. That moving on means the end for Home Assistant.
We should not be happy we have a project founder who is so frustrated to rant like he did on Twitter.
We should not be happy the developers feel under appreciated.
We should not be happy we have users that feel communication is poor.
None of this is good for the project.
Just a hunch at this time @cgtobi, and agreeing with other long time members here. The cloud option and priority being given towards hass.io is similar to what I’ve seen with other open source projects. I don’t see hass.io as a “convenient way to run Home Assistant” to be honest, I see it as appealing to a different primary audience, a change in direction. There’s a few signs recently to support my theory I feel. Don’t get me wrong, I love this project, and I have nothing but the upmost respect for those who have contributed.
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I can’t understand where the quick start guide implied that Hass.io would be the only solution. Fair enough, I read it and thought, hm, easy start for the docker users but not for me. But I just went ahead and had a working environment 30 minutes later. I never really had the impression that it would only work with Hass.io. But anyway, instead of discussing this nuance we should rather go out and play with it. That would make much more sense.
There’s a massive catch 22 there at the moment though - can’t contribute to the documentation if you don’t know how to do it yourself. Can’t work out how to do it yourself if nobody puts the time in to documenting new features.
Once somebody gets a head start, then we can jump in and make the docs a bit more user friendly - but that head start has to come from the devs because they’re the only people who know how it works when it’s brand new
I think the project could be heading towards a differnet audience now. Those who are willing to pay, rather than contribute.
@anon43302295
But @cgtobi has already made that start on how to setup based on his setup, thats where it starts. People taking the initiative and having a play and then reporting the results is their contribution.
@Sitrate
See i don’t. Take the cloud part, there are ways to do it without paying. there are numerous threads on setting up.
Many people made themselves vocal in not willing to pay and that’s fine but for some the paying part is just easier. Again more choice larger audience
I was being more general, in response to a more general philosophical point that you made.
My point being that if you teach a man to fish, he can feed his family.
If you develop a new type of automatic fishing rod that the man can use to feed the whole village but cba to tell anyone how to use it, it wont get used and the man sticks to just feeding his family whilst the rest of the village starves.
Tell him how to use it, he writes a decent instruction manual complete with his own experiences on refined productivity for the rest of the men of the village to use it in shifts, village becomes a prosperous city.
/philospophy
Disclaimer: The use of the word ‘man’ in this random philosphical dreamscape is in no way meant to be sexist, and can be replaced with woman/non-binary-human/potato if that suits you better. The reason for inclusion of the word man is in reference to the old adage only and does not reflect my views on gender equality
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Someone above said
“hassio is build for the less experienced users that are less able to program.”
This is true. I am less able to program, because I am a Network engineer, not a programmer. So, programming wise, I am barely able to get by. Hassio takes care of that need for me.
Someone above ALSO said:
“hass is grown because of the more experienced users that are able to program.”
This only partially true. Since I am not a programmer, and hassio doesn’t require me to be, I spend HOURS per week tweaking, improving increasing my hassio installation. Also, I have convinced four of my smart home friends to install and configure hassio BECAUSE they do not have to be programmers (which they are not). Maybe there is a way to determine the number of home assistant users and the number of hassio users, I don’t know. BUT if there were a way to do that, I would expect that many more people run hassio than run homeassistant. I may be wrong, but it would be good to know.
I would close my comment by saying this…if home assistant is for programmers and hassio is not, and someone like @frenck writes an addon for HASSIO users, then all you programmers who are bitching can just stop your bitching and PROVE you are programmers; you know, do what programmers do. I am not sure it is profitable to throw rocks at a person who is doing something for free, because that person MAY just stop contributing at all. If you lose the hassio community, there will be no way this platform could ever go mainstream, because non-programmers would never even try it.
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He’s not talking about you and your mates working on your own devices, he’s talking about people contributing code to homeassistant so that you and your mates have devices to play with.
Also, nobody here is ‘throwing rocks’, they raised a genuine concern about a project that is very very close to their hearts because of the documentation that was linked to originally suggesting that their favourite home automation platform was about to begin a spiral down the sewage system. Anybody who has come to this thread 24 hours or more after it’s inception cannot see it because it has since been fixed, but the concern was very real and was raised. Then all of a sudden words like ‘attacked’ and ‘throwing rocks’ started getting used and we were told we were the ones overreacting. We were in fact ‘reacting’ to what had been posted, which it later turned out to be incorrect.
Finally, regarding your expectation that more people use hassio, according to a very non-scientific poll going on on facebook (completely unrelated to this, but coincidentally timed)…
95 people responded:
So more than double not on hassio from that sample
Thought I’d better be careful, apparently I’m being misread a lot the last couple of days 
thats the sole OpenHAB user who is confused to where they are
Ok, fair enough. TBH, I don’t understand why everyone is not running hassio as opposed to home assistant, however, admittedly that is probably due to not being a programmer. Can you help me understand why everyone does not run hassio? FWIW, I am running my hassio on top of Ubuntu 18.04. I’m just not familiar enough with the differences between hassio and home assistant to know what I myself might be “missing”.
Oh, and I do accept your disclaimer about the FB response being unscientific…I don’t ever use FB, nor do most of my colleagues, except to be able to access information you can’t access any other way. So, I didn’t see, nor would likely ever see the poll. Don’t even have FB installed on my phone, and only log into it about once a month.The ratio could be still correct…or it could be wrong. Who knows (can you tell how I feel about FB? 
)
Lastly, I’m just grateful to all of the people who contribute to and develop the platform. I really enjoy playing with it, and seeing what I can make it do. The entire contributing community are a great group of folks.
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Rob, I’m getting a DB auth error:
YAML tag !include_dir_named is not supported
Successfully connected to database mysql://hassmaria:***@core-mariadb/homeassistant
Error with query:
SELECT entity_id
FROM states
GROUP BY entity_id
(_mysql_exceptions.OperationalError) (2006, "Host 'addon_a0d7b954_jupyterlablite.hassio' is not allowed to connect to this MariaDB server") (Background on this error at: http://sqlalche.me/e/e3q8)
I used my HA login when I started the browser
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Where is this priority? Hassio users get HA updates a minimum of 9 hours and sometimes even days after the actual update to HA comes out. You probably wouldn’t know this because Hassio is a black box to anyone that doesn’t use it and even to many of those that do. There are some hotfix releases Hassio doesn’t even see because by the time all the images are rendered, the next hotfix was released and available for days…
This priority is completely imagined or it’s just ignorant of how Hassio is able to exist. Home Assistant “proper” has to be there first in order for Hassio to become what is basically a curated and controlled docker environment. There is essentially one dev and there is one main source for all addons within the community repo (who has recently been joined by others and I don’t mean to leave them out because all of their effort and time is absolutely appreciated). They are extremely busy people and also have their own children and lives and work.
See this from the standpoint of a Hassio user and the pace of development will seem like it is chained to the ground for lack of resources compared to Home Assistant itself. Hassio is here because of the sheer will of a few people. The constant admonition and rebuke from those who have no idea and aren’t even “living here” looks like straight up paranoia.
A portal and an addon for hassio was announced.Well, sorry to say but Hassio has a bunch of other addons that were never announced and this apparently freaks people out. But it shouldn’t because they don’t affect Home Assistant in the slightest. Home Assistant “proper” users are still free to config their own duckdns, nginx, choose their own IDE’s, set up motion eye somewhere, or whatever the entire world of computing has to offer. Hassio users have to wait for someone to come up with it.
Home Assistant simply will not grow if it doesn’t appeal to those outside of the crowd that likes to furiously scrawl out complex templates and attach esp8266’s to anything they might stick to. Are they more basic or some kind of “lesser” user? Well, some absolutely are. There are those who expect some kind of iphone app experience and don’t know how to find an IP address on their network. Those people have a rough time no matter what installation method they choose…but many are above this level.
DrZzz, TheHookUp and even Frenck himself have seen large community growth on Youtube and Twitch in the last 6 months. I mean yeah, Frenck doesn’t have the +20,000 subscribers, but who knew that +700 people would sign up for notifications to watch someone grumble, mumble rub his eyes and code at length? 
These viewers aren’t “basic” users watching other basic users use Hassio. These are parents and teachers and floating heads and glitter bow tie wearing grumpy geniuses who prefer to spend more time building and connecting things outside of or with Home Assistant instead of in it…and in some cases all of the above. There’s also a growing community of people who main Lovelace and and their focus seems to be making the UI look great and coming up with funky cards or design as opposed to automation itself. The community is the best community I’ve seen for just about anything. Everyone is from everywhere and it’s a wild west world of a 1000 things that don’t want to work together but do.
About less than a year ago the given number for hassio/docker combined was 1/3 of Home Assistant users by the way…I don’t know what it is now.