Restructuring Addon concept, leveraging docker compose

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Hello!

TLDR:
I think we should/could rethink the whole add-on system leveraging docker compose

Long story

I’m using the debian supervised system and have to migrate.

I tried the home assistant OS approach with KVM. a nightmare. this is something that cannot scale and is too geek oriented

The whole division of the containerized approach and the home assistant os is too divisive. I would go for a unified solution in order to solve once and for all the problem

maybe, using docker compose and a bit over it (like updates notification and a little UI to change it) could be the way (something like the esphome approach)

what do you think?

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Have you tried making a POC already ?

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I use docker-compose for HA. It works fine. You can run portainer if you want a UI and auto checking for container updates.

If you want a simple setup, that’s what HAOS is for.

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working on it

feature that I’ll like are:

  • automatic backup/restore
  • automatic updates
  • a store, but less heavy that the add on store

dunno, wdyt?

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interesting, but I feel like portainer is a bit too much.

but I will have a look at this too

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Hello l,

So install using the container method, it uses dockers instead of add-ons.

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Just use docker and or your favorite manager if you like docker

I have portainer on my ai inference box. I use addons too my ZWaveJSui is an addon.

do what floats your boat. There’s nothing wrong with addons as they stand from. This perspective.

if you don’t like them run container. Your choice.

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I see that there are the 2 options, but this feels fragmented.

I think a unified system where addons are universally available would be nice

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They solve two separate issues. Addons are docker container made easy for haos. Thats it

That means some people naturally made addon that work better for haos than the base container. So people like them.

That doesn’t mean you re-engineer the whole thing. If you need an addon use it on haos. You can haos in VM some people like docker core or portainer or whatever great but if you like that then you may forgo some of the nice to haves

Its the natural effect of choice. Choice is good to quote a friend on the SmartThings community.

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This topic comes up frequently. There is an animated discussion here with seemingly similar objectives. It is not a good discussion, frequently assuming “well you chose docker you should be advanced enough to write your own compose files”. Not helpful. Not everyone uses docker because they’re advanced: people have other reasons. The world is more complex than simple binaries. These discussions are evidence that novice docker users could use a helping hand without being condescendingly told to switch to HAOS.

However I would argue that expecting HA devs to morph their add-on architecture to use, or be more like, docker-compose is unrealistic. It’s likely it exists because the compose architecture was insufficient for their needs.

Maybe the community steps up with a repo of HA-friendly docker-compose files, perhaps even going as far as a HACS-like (or compatible) store for installing them. Or possibly start an open-source project to (dynamically?) “adapt” the add-on format into a compose format for simplified non-supervised installation. Komodo is a promising foss project for container management, integrating it with HACS could be a quick win. Official support would be even better.

In my opinion, HA more desperately needs documentation and in-app UX improvements. Too many docs are HAOS-specific, which confuses novice docker users. Too many UI dialogs don’t auto-detect installation type to point you to the proper docs or repos. Even as a “supported” docker user it is common to feel like a second-class citizen. There is room for improvement.

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I don’t think automatic updates are good. Especially based on how often HA breaks/deprecates stuff. At the very least, you only want to offer updates to the latest patch release of a monthly release at the start of the next month. You probably also want to parse logs for deprecation notices.

I think what is useful is having good documentation for docker images, good example are the lsio images: Images | LinuxServer.io

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feel you, some esphome updated broke some devices I flashed and I had to reflash those manually unmounting from the walls :confused:

I mean, automatic update notification I think are good. but still, I see that the topic is hot and hard :confused: