Planning for a 20+ year time horizon

You’ll get different opinions on this no doubt. My approach would be to do traditional wiring and add smart as an independent layer on top. I installed a system from a local reputable company and their current version is incompatible with what I have installed 20 years ago. So I don’t think of it as a value add and even bought used equipment for spare parts.

On the other hand my electrician back then thought installing it in that attic was a waste of money and insisted on traditional wiring in the attick. Couple of years ago I replaced the switches with zwave and it now integrates seamlessly in HA. You have the option of in the wall modules and traditional switches or switches with a module included. (doesn’t need to be zwave though - anyhting that HA works with is fine).

I don’t think recommending brands is the answer, an alternative to the approach above would be KNX but you would end up spending more.

Anyway, if you go for in-wall modules make sure they are certified for the country you live in.

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I’d be designing the home more around the ability to remove and install new hardware and connections easily, so if something breaks, it’s not a heck of a project to remove and replace it if needed.
There’s a wool-based insulator starting to be used for walls that is so much more temperature, sound and water resistant that in the same thickness as a normal wall, you can have this padded insulation in there, and then a “fake” panelled outer shell on each side of it for running all your cabling without having to dig it through insulation. The default installations with this stuff is to have the “shell” wall to be all removable panels, secure enough to hang photos etc on, but easy enough to pull of that everything low-voltage becomes an almost-diy tool less job. I’ll try find more info on it for you if you like, it was a while ago that I was reading up on it properly.

But that’s the sort of thing I’d look for in “future proofing” your home. Infrastructure things that make any tinkering you end up having to do as time goes on be as effortless as possible, and that also makes it as easy and approachable for if you’re no longer around and family members need to contract someone in to come in, understand what’s there, and fix it.

Even if you plan to go wireless for everything, it would be worth putting in some good backbone Ethernet through everywhere. The worst thing about wifi (and Bluetooth) is when you have competing networks and devices all basically shouting each other’s signal into obscurity. Just being in range of each other causes signal loss, and the obvious answer for the last 10 years to “my wifi signal is poor” is to pour more energy into it. Drown out the competing signals by making your signal stronger.
And of course then the neighbour buys a more powerful router to do the same thing, and it just continues to go from there. I live on the 13th floor of my apartment building and there are over 50 networks whose RSSI is between -50 and -100, some of which are from the ground floor. There are several that have stronger signals from other apartments than my own routers that are only meters away, because their TX power is just set stupidly high as a easy way around the busy spectrum issue. And I’ve checked, none of those are from direct neighbours :joy::sob:

With thorough Ethernet infrastructure, you can just put a bunch of mid-strength wifi routers around your home, so none of your devices are ever very far from a access point, and it completely deals with this situation, and you wont have to troubleshoot interference issues. With the correct setup of the routers, they will just seamlessly pass client connections around based on bandwidth needs and as devices move around the house. You’ll never get hit with the client limit of any of the routers as you add in wifi smart devices all over the place, and you should have some great latency gains.

If you chuck in a pile of cat6/6a, really you shouldn’t need to change it for a long time. It support 10GBs if you upgrade the end points to support it, and you can package just about any sort of signal over Ethernet as needed. A4K 60fps HDR HDMI video connection can be funnelled over a 1GBs Ethernet line, so from a practical sense you should be able to get away with that as your wiring from a bandwidth point of view for a very long time. At most, you might find one or two particularly use cases need direct fibre lines in the future, so you drag fibre for them specifically, but what could we need in every room that would take that kind of bandwidth, right?

(I’m totally gonna be eating my words when we get holograms telemeetings a la Mass Effect and we want them to be taken anywhere in the house :joy:)

For my really infrastructure sort of things, like light switches, ventilation, plumbing control etc, the stuff that really has to work, no matter what, I’m keeping as much of it wired as possible. If it absolutely has to be wireless, I use something in a quiet piece of spectrum, like z-wave or 433 (through now that’s starting to get busier too, seems to be what anything that used to be IR is going to for remotes).

To address “dependable” specifically through, the most important thing I can think of is whenever you’re taking something “dumb” and making it “smart”, “remote controllable”, or “automatable”, the non-negotiable thing really needs to be that you can still use it the “dumb” way totally normally, no questions asked. And fully interchangeably between “smart” and “dumb”.
A light for example: if you get a smart bulb, you can’t use the switch anymore, since you have to keep the switch on for the bulb to be powered and controllable. If the bulb is off and you flip the switch, it stays off cause now it has no power. If you flip the switch again, it will either now turn on, or will remember it’s last “smart” command was to be off, so it stays off.
So for every device you install, ask “If someone doesn’t know it’s smart-enabled, and use it the ‘classical’ way, will that a) work as they would expect every time, and b) mess with the smarts/automations set up with it in a way that will require someone correcting it?”
That will lead you to the most dependable solutions in general. Worked well so far for my aircon, light switches, the cooling for my AV/consoles, smart lock and laundry/bathroom ventilation.
We talk about smart home and automation as “making life easier”, but often forget that we have years of muscle memory of how all these things work, so making sure that work like they used to is just as important as making them work smarter for us

I decided for KNX 2 years ago. Main advantages:

  • existing 30 years now
  • widely used in commercial buildings
  • 300 or more companies (no problem if one of them stops business)
  • still development, but downwards compatible
  • if you mainly use REG devices in a central place (many channels), I think the price is fair for what you get
  • decentralized (if 1 device fails, the others still work. sole exception: power supply - here it’s advisable to have a backup solution)
  • good support in HA! (and also in other smart home projects)
  • works totally stable, not a single malfunction in more than a year now

There are some disadvantages:

  • in my opinion, KNX is only sensible if you use it for almost everything (light, covers, room temperature…). Otherwise, the system parts are too expensive (Power Supply, Ethernet Gateaway)
  • only makes sense in a new building or in a complete revision of the electric system
  • It may be expensive (but still I think the price is fair for what you get)

For what its worth, I put in a lot of cat 6 cabling and a good switch even though most sensors are wifi connected. My rationale is if it doesnt get used for data I can power most devices as power over ethernet (or parallel the pairs for higher current devices) eliminating the need for most DC cabling and eliminating annoying batteries for sensors. All the data hungry devices use 100mb cat6 ethernet.
:slightly_smiling_face:

We just renovated our home and replaced the electrical wiring. As others already stated and suggested here, I went for CAT7 cables wherever possible:

  • CAT7 cables run to every light switch
  • An Ethernet relay module is used for controlling the lights (the switches are connected to the digital inputs), directly supported by HA
  • Floor heating controller can be controlled via Ethernet, requires a custom translator for HA integration
  • Wired security system, based on CAT7 cabling, can be interfaced via USB to HA
  • Wired video doorbell/intercom based on CAT7, PoE powered
  • Most importantly: A rather expensive, PoE-capable Ethernet switch
  • PoE-powered WiFi AP

Most important components (light, floor heating) do not rely on the network or any automation since they all have a standalone mode which was very important for me. Everything has “traditional” controls, i.e. classic light switches and nothing fancy - another important decision.

Since moving in, I’ve already found a few missing wires, but nothing that couldn’t be fixed by using one of the CAT7 cables (power can be provided by a PoE extractor, Audio can be sent over CAT7 by passive adapters, HDMI can be sent over CAT7 etc.) - apart from one missing light switch where I’ve installed an inexpensive 433MHz switch and an RFLink gateway.

And as others have also already stated: Documentation is important, especially for complex systems. Everything is in a nice spreadsheet, including VLAN configuration, patch panel <-> switch port mapping etc.

What a remarkable assertion given we operate in a wireless world of gadgets, the internet and the cloud as our lives are increasingly intertwined with wire free technologies. Strange comment but I concede the 240 volts 115 amps 27KW mains supply to my home - is still wired - at least until some clever dude figures out how to carry 27KW through the air :slight_smile:

I said some stuff. Which certainly includes security-related devices. Wireless shutter-contacts for your alarmsystem can be jammed, and thus may not trigger the alarm when required. Additionally the battery can die, having the same effect. Both scenarios won’t occur with wired systems. Unless you know of a wireless solution that doesn’t have that attack-vector. In that case I’d like to hear about it. :+1:

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:roll_eyes: this is getting rather silly. Any wireless transmission/reception can be “jammed”. Jeez if someone wants to circumvent a system , with determination , then they will.

Hahaha , so when I visit your house - I can just cut all the wires then. :ok_hand: good to know.

Dear dear me :roll_eyes:

Yeah, sawing your way into a wall from outside someone’s house to cut the wiring in their security system is certainly less noticeable to the neighbours than turning on a wireless jammer from your car, then quickly forcing a door.

If the cabling is all done outside the walls, just hanging about, then you’re absolutely right, disabling whatever system is there is much easier and requires more common tools and less know-how than disabling wireless comms. But as soon as those cables are embedded in walls, wireless comms are the easier attack vector

Depends where one resides. Here in this rural area, I doubt anyone would notice a JCB digging up the road to get to fibreoptics for your cabled wired broadband :sweat_smile: :sweat_smile:

Returning to your previous assertion , “wires are the way to go” , er no. Highly subjective and dependant on application. There is no right and wrong. Merely the most appropriate for the application. For example, I wouldn’t want my connection to the ISP data centre in London - 290 miles away - to be wireless - well not just quite yet, :grinning:

er yes. I personally avoid Wireless everywhere unless there is no option. Wired is always more reliable. In fact for YEARS I refused to use any wireless at all.

You’re right.

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This is true, here every time nbnCo sends someone to add an extra fibre strand to the backbone in the street, just about everyone will stop to ask what’s going on and how it will effect their Netflix :joy:

Also very true. I should probably refactor to be more along the lines of “start as wired, and go wireless when it is more appropriate”.
But yeah, I can stream 1080p video over my wifi network from my NAS to my TV, due to the masses of competing networks all trying to over power each other, but once I rigged everything via Ethernet… :joy:

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move house :grin: :ok_hand:

Oh that’s the dream haha :joy:
When I have the moolah I’m gonna build the most kickass home, so smart everywhere :joy:

And the outer walls gonna be a faraday cage cause these damn kids won’t turn down their loud rap wifi

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