And some things get missed, that’s why bugs exist.
Because that wasn’t part of the original design intention. The original design intention of a time format option was for non-relative time stamps.
not sure why we are mixing time format here.
I understand the relative time as something introduced independently to time format. Time format applies only in the case of absolute time.
There are two problems
- no option to choose between absolute and relative.
- no alternate format (ie hover)
Both of them relate to the “displaying the relative time” feature.
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Yes, but you keep hammering “Why is this incomplete functionality” when the only functionality that was added to change time format was specifically designed to target time stamps not relative times. That’s why it’s relevant.
you probably take displaying time on FE as a single feature.
I’m considering them as two separate ones. While one of them didn’t left space for another.
IMO relative time displaying should never be accepted in this form. Then it would cause further consequences
each feature would be compartmentalized, that’s typically how PRs work. It seem’s you’re trying to relate this to an agile story. Which simply doesn’t exist in a volunteer environment. It sometimes exists when there’s a discussion about it in architecture.
I understand. But again: relative time PR should include an option to show absolute time; from the beginning.
Without it, the PR shouldn’t be accepted as incomplete and breaking change (removal of the previous way of time presentation)
Again, that wasn’t part of the original scope when relative time was added. Sorry, but that’s how it was when it was added. The original implementation was when only entities card existed. That’s how old the feature is. Lovelace didn’t even exist.
And the original tooltip was designed to only show last_changed and last_updated. There was nothing in the scope about optionally changing it’s display. It was simply: Display this information in the tool tip. Does that mean the feature isn’t fully fleshed out? No, it just means that the person added what they wanted to see, which was that information.
Do you mean that relative time is in HA since HA beginning?
I could bet the absolute time display has been replaced with relative one (or appeared in this form in new places) about 3 years ago
Yes, it was implemented long ago.
You’re thinking of timestamp sensors being added.
to put it into perspective, the want/need for relative time dates as far back as may 10th 2016
Unfortunately any PRs for the original UI are lost when lovelace was created.
I agree. Sometimes relative time makes more sense, sometimes exact time. Sometimes it comes down to individual preference.
I think in the backups list, relative time longer than 1 week never makes any sense: Having 4 backups with the same version and the date is “last week” isn’t helpful at all. With exact dates I would know which of those are “automatic backups” created on schedule and which where triggers by the user.
Sometimes having the option would be great. For example there could be a general option for all lovelace cards like there is for visibility and card size now. Having to create template cards just for converting the time format is not just time consuming but generally worse for performance.
I do understand that options like those are kind of niche and this is an open source project. If I was able to create such feature, I would. But sadly I don’t have any experience at all with TS or JS.
You are absolutely right: OP could get the information from the history graph, so it’s not like the information is not there at all. However, you have to admit that a tooltip showing exactly the information it should be explaining isn’t very helpful at all. 
The backup system and it’s UI is unrelated to this conversation my comments above. My reply was specifically for History Graph, and entities and the comments were made prior to the creation of the backup system.
And for clarification on the tooltip, it’s just to show last updated and last changed, 2 properties of the state object. The tooltip in general needs an update to show last reported as well.
How did you come to this conclusion?
The fact my original post did not provide examples from the backup system, doesn’t mean the request doesn’t apply here. It applies everywhere,
since date presentation/formatting should be coherent across the whole system.
“this conversation” is not with you. It’s about OP. And backups view fits well to the described problem.
No, he replied to my comment maxym. If that wasn’t his intention, he shouldn’t have directly replied to me.
People have conversations in threads all the time without involving OP. If you didn’t have this thread on “watch”, you wouldn’t have gotten a notification, where I still would because he replied to my comment.
And this is last time I’m going to ask this, please stop trying to find reasons to argue with me.
Sorry, I could have stated this better - a lot, now if I think about it…
Here is where I was coming from:
- The backup system was reworked in a major way recently and the situation I pointed out annoys me. So I thought I’d post it to see, if I’m the only one or maybe there is room for improvement. Now would be the best time for such feedback, as devs are probably working on fixes for the new backup system anyway.
- So I searched the forums and found this thread. I thought I could revive it instead of creating a new one. This made sense to me because as I understand it, OPs issue and mine are practically the same - just different examples.
- I also think it makes sense to add my example to OPs so devs can see that this issue relates to more than one (niche) area.
The reason why I directly reply to your Post, @petro, were these:
- You mentioned that by the time of your post, only 10 people had voted for this thread, insinuating that this might be an issue for a very small group of people. So I wanted to point out, that due to recent updates, this might have changed now.
- You argued, that some users want relative times and some exact times. I agree with this assessment and wanted to elaborate on this by differentiating 3 cases: Sometimes absolute time makes more sense; sometimes relative time makes more sense and sometimes (as you rightly pointed out) it comes down to personal preference.
- In your post you gave a solution for OPs problem (using the history graphs). I think this is very important because as long as there are workarounds the need for devs to invest time is greatly reduced. Therefore I wanted to point out, that this solution isn’t solving every instance of OPs issue anymore because there is no history graph for the new backup table.
I do realise now, that I did not make any of these points very clear and in context of the going back and forth in this thread prior to my post, me replying to you directly could very well be understood as me trying to start an argument. I apologise for that and hope I made clear now that this was never my intention.
As for the tooltip: You are right. I totally overlooked that this is showing those 2 properties and not just relating the original information.
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Don’t worry about starting an argument. I did not get that impression. I was just explaining my posts before it was miss interpreted by a 3rd party.