Eurotronic Spirit Thermostats firmware issues

You should create a separate thread for hardware recommendations.
But what you’re describing could be controlled with something like this:


or more advanced with a PID controller:

Cheers

So, I’ve just received a “new” Eurotronic Spirit from Amazon. What I can already tell is that the firmware version is exactly the same as it was before (application_version: 0.16).

Now I’ll have to wait a couple of days/weeks (depending on the weather) to test it again, but I don’t have high hopes about this “new” device… :confused:

How do you know it’s a “new” one?
Is there a manufacturing days on them? If not is there a way to identify this from the S/N?
Planning to get some and is like to be able to be clear on my request when I message the seller to ensure I get some from the right batch

I don’t. Hence the quotation mark. I only hope this is a fixed one since the info I have is that issues were between 2019 Sept and 2019 Dec, and already 10 months passed by. But I surely cannot know.

It does have a S/N (in the battery compartment) but there’s no publicly available list of the wrong ones.

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Would you mind sharing your heating control script? And how you manage the time-scheduling (German is perfectly fine for me too)

(This is a bit off-topic for the firmware issues, but here is a great scheduler:
https://community.home-assistant.io/t/scheduler-card-custom-component/
it is still in development, but is already great.)

I want to avoid to handle manually valve opening like @jo-me said and let the thermostat autonomous.
Is there any other z-wave thermostat (or zigbee) with normal behaviour ?

I saw a few days ago that there is a new version, but it is also a bit more expensive than the old one. But I couldn’t bring myself to try the new one yet. :sweat_smile:

if someone can test :pray: :grin:

I finally decided, with winter approaching, to try again with sorting out these TRV’s (I have the INS issue, on nearly all mine).

I saw in a German forum, a response somebody had posted from Eurotronic confirming that the batch of TRV’s I have are faulty due to a component fault. I’m going to now return them all for replacement. If there is a newer version, I hope they do the decent thing and replace them with a newer version, if it resolves the issues.

I already had the return address/DHL label generated from the details in the other post, but yesterday had a response from Eurotronic after a couple of weeks.

Thought I’d post their response online here, since I know a lot of people have these issues, and I couldn’t find one in English anywhere:

Thank you for having chosen a product from our company.

In recent years, our Spirit Z-Wave Plus surely has prompted many positive headlines in the heating and smart home area.

This has surely approved our sophisticated hard and software technology.

Unfortunately, we had to find out, that one of the electronic components was defect in the delivery batch of autumn 2019.

The failure of this electronic component leads to the often described jump to the „INS“-modus or the overheating. The only thing, which we can do in this case is, to say sorry and to assure you to replace affected products unbureaucratically.

Devices, which do not show the described error within the first 2 weeks, are not affected by this problem.

We would be pleased if you would continue to place your trust in us.

Due to this problem, we would be happy to replace your defective thermostat.

Please send the defective goods to our service center:

Teknihall GmbH
Dept. Eurotronic GmbH
Breitefeld 15
64839 Munster

A copy of the invoice and the address of the sender must be enclosed with the package.

You can create a free return label at DHL.

Following link: www.myreturn.biz + number 0080088800666.

The link takes you to a mask, select the country flag and enter the respective sender data.

Please indicate here as a reference: AU Eurotronic.

As soon as the goods have arrived at Teknihall, they will be exchanged as soon as possible.

The service can be reached by customers at the following telephone number: 06667 91847-17.

We would be pleased if you would continue to place your trust in us.

So this confirms the INS issue, but also about overheating issues.

Will update here once I get the replacements…

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At least it is confirmed now from many sides. I just tried my replaced one from Amazon, and before I had no INS issue just the overheating one, now this one does not even want to properly install. After trying to install it onto the valve the Err, Err1, Err2, Err3 errors showing up randomly.

I’m really loosing my faith in Eurotronic. The new version 2 is noticeably higher priced than the not version 2 one. For that price one could by a different and working TRV.

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I find the Zigbee TRVs equally temperamental. Some TRVs will just randomly disconnect from the network and on the display will not show the Antenna icon. Removing the battery fixes this and if not, frequent resets are required to repair.

I also noticed that rechargeable batteries (such as Bonai Rechargeable Batteries AA 2,800 mAh NI-MH Batteries High Capacity) will drain within 2-3 days and immediately upon replacement show 5% charge (often also no charge).

I found that some thermostats will randomly go into boost mode or will just open the valve all the way while displaying an “ERR” on the display. After a few resets everything is back to “normal”. Those are not TRVs I would leave running by itself without supervision.

I contacted Eurotronic 2-3 weeks ago, no response yet. I did order the TRVs beginning of September, so I believe that they are not affected by the component failure. Unfortunately not many other TRVs out there.

That is an issue with many electronic devices - if you wish to use rechargeable batteries it is best to check beforehand if the device supports that. Rechargeable batteries have different characteristics (lower voltage and I think lower resistance), causing “battery meters” and such components to misread their capacity. Some device have a setting you need to tourn on when using rechargeables.

I finally decided to try with OpenZwave and after some digging and trying around it worked out quite well. They look very stable and reporting properly to HA.

Issues still pending:

  • Valve opening is only available via MQTT or appdaemon (the climate entity shows the opening percentage if the reporting is enabled) however the UI does not show anything regarding valve opening.
  • Setting the valve manually in Manufacturer specific mode does not work with HA (I could only do it by directly sending the commands via MQTT)
  • The valves seem to respond with some delay compared to my old setup when changing values from the UI…but this may be because I run everything in a raspberry

What I found very promising is that for example, you can set all the configuration via MQTT like child control, delay of the backlight, valve opening reporting, etc which opens a lot of possibilities to customize…the downside is that you need to find the ids to send the commands per each valve.

I think you can do the same via the “original” zwave integration, via node configuration options/protection, via the gui or by service call (zwave.set_config_parameter) - just FYI

I’m using Eurotronic Spiritz TRV’s purchased in sept/oct 2018.

I don’t believe they are supported in OZW 1.4, and so I prioritised moving to OZW 1.6, using OpenZwaveMQTT by RobertsLando and now the newer ozwdaemon.

I have firmware version 0.16 on all 4 TRV’s.

in HA they look like this:

hvac_modes: off, heat
min_temp: 7
max_temp: 35
preset_modes: none, Heat Eco, Full Power, Manufacturer Specific
current_temperature: 19.3
temperature: 19
preset_mode: Heat Eco
node_id: 5
valve_position: 16 %
friendly_name: Bedroom Thermostat: Mode
supported_features: 17

Regarding report thresholds, I have mine set to:
Temperature Report Threshold = 5
Valve Opening Percentage Report Threshold = 1

The TRV’s have their own PID logic unless you use them in manufacturer mode - which allows you to control the valve opening directly.
I don’t know the differences between heat and heat eco, i run my in heat eco as that sounds more economic.

I do find as others have reported that the valves rarely close entirely. I can’t say if this is right or wrong as far as the TRV is concerned.

if you are deciding what a demand for heat is (when to turn the heating on) then I guess you will find that saying >0% value opening is going to mean the boiler is on, but potentially little to no heat will get to the radiator.

I don’t know if there is a better way to determine the demand. In OZW 1.4 I used Air temperature and set-point to determine if there was a demand. Problem with that approach is that you are second guessing the logic in the TRV.

in my current setup I have two implementations to determine the demand.

one is per TRV, if the valve% is >20% then turn on heating, if <20% turn off.

newer version averages the valve% over all TRVs, which means one TRV is still enough to turn the heating on, but only if it is very very open. otherwise, all TRV’s need to be fairly open to trigger. In this version, I’ve also set a lower demand for turning the boiler off to reduce frequent and short heat demands.

I don’t think I have any other issues, not the INS issue, or sticky valve issue. However, i did replace all my radiator valves as they were very very old, so perhaps mechanically these are in a better condition. I wouldn’t say I’ve overly tighten the TRV down either, just hand tight.

hope this helps, or helps hope for the winter

According to the manual there are 2 separate temperature setpoints. One for normal/comfort and one for eco/energy saving mode. If you switch the Preset mode to “Heat Eco” in HA, then you are adjusting the eco setpoint independent of the normal setpoint on the TRV. If you then press the +/- button on the TRV when in eco mode, it will switch eco mode off, and jump to the normal setpoint/switch back to normal mode (Preset=None in HA).

I think the preset mode would be useful if you could switch it on from the TRV itself, but you can only enable it via zwave. I guess it could still be handy, if like me you live alone, and could put all the radiators in eco mode regularly, but then push a button on the TRV to give heating to the room you’re in. But with HA, there are far more automated ways to do that! :slight_smile:

Damn, actually I thought that my thermostats have been running fine since last winter, but nothing there.

Yesterday evening when I opened the windows my thermostat automatically goes OFF, when I wanted to close the windows again I was surprised that the heating is running at full power. Then I saw the thermostat flashing and the display said INS. :unamused:

It’s crazy with these things. Now they have at least halfway decent regulation, even if they still reheat and sometimes took a little longer to turn off, but this error shows me again how vulnerable the Eurotronics are.

Now I’ll have to complain about the current thermostat to Amazon, or at best both thermostats I still have. I am so happy with the Eurotronic zwave Plus, but what good is it if they can fail and the heater is running at full power in continuous operation. If that happens when you are not at home for a longer period of time it’s not so nice.

Why can’t there be an affordable z-wave or zigbee thermostat that works properly. Something is always wrong, either you need an additional gateway, the functions are limited or the regulation is totally crappy.

Controlling the thermostat via preset mode with automations has never worked properly and it is also unnecessary. I only work with the heat mode and control everything about the temperatures, and of course the off mode.

Sorry, I have forgotten your question. I can send you my scripts when I get the chance, or I can post it in my old thread here.

BiNiCKNiCH

Hello,

Sorry but I had to create a new account, due to a rule that avoid “new members” from replying more than 3 times in the same conversation (this is the 1st time I see that… :smile:)

Here is my contribution with these valves…

I had the same issues as many people (InS and overheat) with 13 valves (1st batch of 6, 2nd batch of 7), all manufactured in 2019.

Like you, getting some help from Eurotronics was a huge dream. I grabbed some information from Aeotec, who sell the same product rebadged. Then I understood that all my issues were due to a manufacturing process issue.

6 of my valves have been sent to Eurotronics for exchange 5 weeks ago. I NEVER had any answer from Eurotronics, and I think that I will never get back my valves… :confused:
Seeing that, the 7 other valves have been sent to Amazon for exchange, and they were exchanged immediately.

My current situation : I now have only 7 valves, all manufactured recently in 2020. They are installed since 3 weeks now. What I can say is that it seems that they are working (relatively) better.
BUT… :

  • I have already experienced overheat issues with 3 of them… they report an opening percentage of 0, but they are not correctly closed. A recalibration, or a “boost-off” sequence solve the issue, as it was the case before.
  • One valve has already crashed (not responding to zwave controller and display locked) : removing/replacing batteries solved the issue.

I have noticed one thing with the 3 valves suffering from overheat issue : normally, during calibration, the sequence is the following :

  1. valve closes until it reach the beginning of mechanical resistance. This is the valve stud starting point
  2. valve re-opens fully
  3. valve closes until it reach maximal resistance. This is the valve stud closing state.
    So that there are 3 valve movements during calibration process.

But with the 3 valves, affected by the overheat issues, the calibration process is not the same :

  1. valves closes until it reach MORE THAN the beginning of mechanical resistance (i dont know why)
  2. valve closes until it reach maximal resistance, without intermediate full opening.
    So that there are only 2 valve movements during calibration process.

The overheat issues does not happen directly, but only after some days of operation. I think that the valve loses the calibration points.

I have also seen that Eurotronics has released a new version of the valves. Knowing them, I think that they have just solved all the (manufacturing?) issues they had, and multiplied the price by 2. I never had such a catastrophic experience with any electronic device manufacturer, with such a bad after sales service (which does not exist, in this case…).

For the 6 vales that I have never got back, I have engadged legal procedures. I won’t let go. :wink:

Hi all, I’ve read this post and have some questions.

  • The problem is well known. Isn’t there any firmware update to fix the valve problems ?
  • Did-you notice a difference between the reported temperature and the “real one”? All my 6 Spirit Thermostats report 1.4 to 1.7 bellow correct value. I’ve bought them at different times and got some replaced. All of them have this problem.
  • I changed the offset temperature parameter to fix this problem. But now the vavle doesn’t seem to take this parameter into account. So if I set +1C offset, It will close the valve 1C before the desired temp.
  • Any chance to get the valve report/set available on Hassio one day? I don’t really like messing with the default installation.