I currently have a simple wired shutter with a 3 way wall switch (up / down / 0) and line only at the switch (so neutral only at the shutter). I’d like to automate this a bit by using a Shelly 2.5 (or any similar).
The current directly wired setup is very straightforward (see figure 1): N goes to the shutter; L goes to the wall switch which has 2 wired outputs (up / down) from the wall to the shutter. No neutral at the switch and not much space.
I’d like to do the automation with 1 relay, that’s why I was thinking about the Shelly 2.5. If I replace the 3 way wall switch to a simple wall button (lack of N wire and space behind the switch…) and do some minimal rewiring (see figure 2) I think the following “loop” rule set might work:
Button press (going up): down relay OFF, some safety delay, up relay ON.
Button press (stop at position): down relay OFF, up relay OFF.
Button press (going down): down relay ON, some safety delay, up relay OFF.
Button press (stop at position): down relay OFF, up relay OFF.
Problem:
I have to know (store?) the last applied direction of the shutter to be able to start the roller to the correct direction (button press). For example if the system is stopped (state 2 or 4) and the button is pressed again, I need to know the system’s previous state (1 or 3) to start to the correct direction.
Solution:
Here is where I need your kind help. :S I was thinking about storing a value in input_boolean. When the shutter goes upwards I set it to ON so next time I will know that if it is ON I have to start the shutter down (otherwise up).
EDIT: And if you need to pass the up/down into the shelly, then just break the L up and L dn into the sw1 and sw2. You don’t want your line coming from your switch.
Thanks! My only problem is that the L line can only come from the switch, because I cannot rebuild the wiring in the wall. So L needs to go through the switch which occupies one of the two outgoing wires… this is why (I think) I need to change my 3 way switch to a button and somehow store the last applied direction (input_boolean?). :S
so you don’t have access to the line attaching to your switch? that seems like a code violation. You should be able to split the line in the box for the switch.
Without a neutral you can’t do this.
According to another member here he says the neutral requirement was only since 2004 in the US (I’m not in the US)
So an older installation ???..
I thought about putting two relays in the cowling and have the feeds both power the shelly and swith the points (I think shelly’s can accept line input voltages and sonoff’s can’t??? Not sure…)
Problems with this are many assuming the switch can operate on half wave power (you’d have to put blocking diodes to power from either switch) but the main issue is it wouldn’t be powered ‘unless’ your finger was on ‘a’ button.
I think you will have to bite the bullet, hack the wall to put in an extra wire and then replaster
There is a way, but I wouldn’t do it.
Wire the live through the box to bring a live to your cover.
Install the shelly in the cover.
Fit a remote (battery powered) that can be seen by HA and used to operate the shelly.
I like to be able to operate stuff if/when HA is down
Yeah, the probem is that the N is not in the wall box (behind the switch) as shown in the first figure. :S
N goes directy to the shutter.
L goes to the wall box - behind the switch.
There are 2 cables between the wall box and the shutter controlled by the switch (L for UP and DOWN).
What I was thinking is reusing the existing cables and putting a shelly 2.5 to the shutter’s housing as follows (second figure).
N goes directly to the shelly (in the shutter housing, so minor change)
L goes to the wall box (no change) + replacing the 2 way wall switch to a push button.
Reusing the 2 wires between the box and the shutter (used to be an L for UP and DOWN): 1) L would go directly from the box to the Shelly (power) 2) L would go from the new push button to the Shelly’s SW1/SW2.
With the above (if I’m right :)) every button push would trigger the Shelly’s SW1/SW2 and in the meanwhile the Shelly would have a constant L and N - so power.
In HA I would use an input_boolean to store the correct direction for the button push.
I managed to make this work.
So the issue was, that - in the original setup - there is no N in the wall switch, so I cannot put a smart device behind the switch. Rewiring is not an option because I did not want to start such work in the house.
So here is the solution:
Original setup
Wall switch
3 wires and a switch: incoming L and a 2 way switch that directs this L into 2 cables (let’s call them Lup and Ldn) which go to the shutter housing. So depending on which direction you activate with the switch, L gets connected to Lup or Ldn and goes to the shutter’s input. Note that the wall switch has no N!
Shutter housing
Incoming N cable and the Lup and Ldn live wires which are coming from the wall switch. And - of course - the shutter motor with inputs for (N, Lup, Ldn).
“Smart” setup
Wall switch
The incoming L cable is now connected directly to Lup and besides goes into a momentary switch that - when pressed - connects L to Ldn. In other words: Lup is an L from now on, and Ldn is activated momentary by the switch - when pressed.
Shutter housing
Lup (which is a constant L from now on) is used to power a Shelly 2.5 in shutter mode. N (which was already in the housing) also powers the Shelly and the shutter’s N. Shelly’s 2 outputs go to the shutter’s Lup and Ldn. Ldn (which now acts as a momentary L) is connected to the Shelly’s SW inputs.
And that’s it. When you press the wall button it connects L to Ldn, which gives a signal to Shelly’s SW inputs. Every press moves Shelly to the next stage in an up/stop/down/stop rotation. No rewiring and works fine.
I’m actually in the exact situation is it possible for you to post a picture of the management cables, or a drawing cause I actually don’t understand how you did
I see that ou found the solution. I have the same problem. But I didnt understan your explanation.
Could you please send me schematic for your solution.
