Hi, I would like to seek some advice regarding the max. number of wifi smart devices. I have Hassio running with over 15 smart devices connected to my router. These devices are including, Sonoff wall switch, Sonoff Basic modules, Xiaomi smart bulb, Xiaomi camera and etc. Besides those, i have TV box, laptop, cellphones and etc which are also connecting to the same network.
I’m wondering if there is any max. allowable devices that can be connected to my router (TP Link AC1200) before the network start being congested and having stability issue while being controlled by Hassio. And all my devices are still connecting with their respective cloud services.
Will adding a second router as access point (I’m having one PPPoE connection only) will help to improve the stability? I’m planning to add more devices in coming days.
Also, does putting those devices in local mode (by flashing with custom firmware/Tasmota) will help to improve the network stability?
Please advise.
Also, feel free to share the best network configuration for smart home that controlled with Hassio.
I have about 60, but I have 3 access points and all heavy stuff (streaming, computers etc) is on ethernet. All my smart devices are very low traffic, and I have had zero reliability issues.
Wifi congestion can come in multiple forms. Too many devices for your router to handle, too many devices that are all requesting air time, especially if there are ones that are far from the router, and too much congestion on the channel from you and your neighbors.
As a rule of thumb, keep adding until it starts hurting, then upgrade your router hardware.
Don’t just add a second router without doing anything, you’ll be in a ‘Dual-NAT’ situation and none of your stuff will talk between the routers appropriately. You need to setup the second router as an Access Point only, where the first router does the assigning of IP address, firewalling, and NATing.
I can’t recommend enough going with a pro-sumer setup like Ubiquiti gear. I run 1x UAC-AC-Pro that is mounted in the ceiling in a central location for wireless and a EdgeRouter-X in the basement that is actually doing the router work (NAT,DHCP,DNS,etc)
There is obviously the IP address range limitation of the router (254) and then obviously radio interferrence incurred by the addition of each new device… However…
In my experience, most IoT WiFi devices use UDP (+ Fire and Forget) as prototocol… WiFi is NOT good protocol for IoT devices that generally only need a small payload… For things like switches etc, your Home Assistant instance needs confirmation that a comand has been received etc… Hence you will find that a protoco llike Zigbee and Z-WAve to be far more reliable that WiFi…
HOwever back to the question, it will all be dependant on the kit you have… also steer clear of “Range extenders” and get a proper Mesh or AP based solution for WiFi… but most importantly… use the right tool for the job… there is a reason wifi switches are so cheap…
There’s no typical limit like with low power and tiny ram zigbee stuff. Unless you have a buggy firmware on your Asus router, I wouldn’t be surprised if you’re able to maintain a connection to ~200 devices.
Every device you connect via ethernet cable has its own 10/100/1000 Mbps connection to the switch or router
Wifi is just 1 connection.
So all your wifi devices are use that one invisible cable.
Wifi in essence is a shared bandwidth. Total number of clients connect to an access point will decrease it’s ability to give every device a steady connection.
Reason why you see so main access points in one lecture auditorium at the University or a conference center.
If you going to be serious about HA you need to get proper wifi Access points.
@uiguy
seriously ZigBee sucks.
It’s the most unreliable part of my current HA
None of my Wifi IoT devices have missed a beat.
@henry8866
Rob from The Hookup had Google mesh wifi
And he changed to Ubiquiti access points
He did a few videos on it.
Yeah depends on lots of things, but mainly you will start to notice your speed test drop off as you add tons of wifi devices since it is a shared link. YMMV, but I agree with the basic premise that zwave/zha are better suited for the job in general. So I disagree with buying fancy ubiquity wifi stuff just to add more iot. It’s nice to have and if that excuse buys you more WAF, go big, but mesh isn’t a valid solution for iot scaling.
I’ve also got a couple Ubiquiti WAPs and a pfSense device doing the routing and have zero complaints with the WiFi stuff. My zwave/zigbee stuff gave me tons of problems, multiple times, with multiple configurations, so I disagree with the person saying that zwave/zigbee is the better way to go. All of my DIY esp8266 devices have been more reliable.
One thing you don’t say is if you’re currently experiencing issues though. If you’re having issues at <20 devices, you might want to check stuff out though … are you seeing interference from neighbors devices or is your setup is too close to the microwave or something? I’ve seen faulty power cause some issues and a cheap UPS can help with some issues like that (and it’s also nice to have in general).
No need to jump to new equipment right away when you can run some tests with a phone an an app.
Thanks. I’m using Tmobile AC1900 router flashed asus-merlin. It is pretty strong.
One of my wifi bulb (tasmota) at outside garage has problem connecting to wifi, although wifi signal is strong when I tested using my phone. I ended up put a cheap wifi extender at garage, then the wifi bulb connected ok. I would guess the weakness is on the wifi bulb side?
I agree with zigbee being a bit unstable, but that also comes down to the type of sensor. My z-wave stuff is flawless… i had loads of issues with wifi switches not firing every time. They would miss roughly 1 in 10 commands (belkin wemo switches) and my wifi is fine at 4 uap pro’s, 1 ap lr, and 2 outdoor ap pro’s…
Wifi is for people/media, ble, zigbee, z-wave, dect are for things
IDK, I think adding ubiquity ap’s is great if you like want netflix 4k in the garden, but if all you need is to hit a pump or light switch, it seems like going after ants with a sledge hammer to me. I’ve got an ac86u that is more than enough to cover my relatively small property (1/4acre) with strong signals. If I find that I’m dropping too many wifi iot’s devices on it that my phones/pcs start to suffer, I don’t think I’ll be looking to add AP’s just to fix that. Instead I’d look to expanding my zwave setup. OTOH, if netflix 4k is stuttering in the garden, then yeah maybe I can talk the wife into another AP.
It isn’t a great choice though. I 100% am drawn to esp devices for their flexibility, power, and pricing (also the level of manual control you can have over them is a cozy feeling). For non-battery nodes they are very, very compelling… however there is the wifi limitation that unfortunately does take away from that flavor (for me anyways). When talking about battery powered devices, there’s no question zwave is clearly the dominant choice (unless you go down the esp32 lora rabbit hole or similar). ZHA… meh.
Also, when I see someone mention zwave not working reliably… I’ve had some similar experiences as well, but in all cases it was due to improper zwave implementation by the device manufacturer (ex, jasco switches not reporting state themselves, aeotec recessed g5 sensors not reporting battery level…). OTOH, if the manufacturer does a good job, zwave is solid as steel (ecolink devices for example, kick arse).
edit: There is the idea of cost parity though… like a few ubiquity APs and a ton of esp’s might cost similar to a few zwave repeaters and a ton of zwave devices. When you need lots of nodes, esp scales better in the wallet department. So there’s I guess no clear winner unless you factor in the user’s ability to configure AP’s and such. If that’s not an issue, the wifi way may hold a candle to reasonable arguments. I’d like to see some research to this end… a cost comparison of filling a set of typical applications with wifi mesh + esp vs zwave. I got a feeling it could be a close finish… with of course wifi getting the nod in regards to security.
Yeah we can use zwave/zigbee to reduce wifi devices.
Regarding zwave devices, I saw somewhere people add zwave device to ring alarm base station, but ring’s website doesn’t have list of compatible third party devices. It website says “Although other Z-Wave sensors can be added to the system, they will not be used for security purposes or to dispatch the police.” I am totally fine with no dispatch stuff, but as long as those devices show up in HA that would be sufficient (using https://github.com/tsightler/ring-alarm-mqtt), does anyone have experience on what devices can be added to ring alarm system and can be show up on HA?
I would try and use Ring for the hardware you have and then integrate Ring into your existing setup as opposed to try and shoehorn stuff into Ring… Ring is a walled graden in the cloud… Home assistant by definition is the exact opposite… If my ring doorbell goes down, I will be replacing it with something else…
I would avoid too much expenditure on the RIng family…
I have burnt up my share of routers. The DHCP fails but still able to use it as an wireless access point though. I have done a little research on this matter. Your average consumer router can only support about 15 to 30 connections. After that it will start dropping packets (getting errors). I currently have a Motorola Arris SB6190 cable modem, into an Edgerouter-X, into a TP-Link Archer AX-50 (AX3000) wifi6 as an access point, and my old Netgear AC1750 (with DD-WRT) as an AP , and my old, old ASUS R6400v2 (with Tomato) as an AP too. On my network I have an assortment of Security Cameras, Xbox’s, PC, Several phones, and a many wifi iot devices. 104 in total. and added more every month. I have a 400 mb cable service with Spectrum. I also stream all of my TVs through Android boxes. About 2TB up and down a month. I still have a glitch in the Matrix once in a while, but for the most part all is good…
PS: The most important thing to get out of this is you need an enterprise router like the EdgeRouterX. This little thing is powerful and full of options. You will get it…
