We have these sliding glass doors to the patio, and the doors lock with a handle that folds in toward the door, so in the locked state, the rotation changes at a hinge, and the far edge of the handle itself is slightly closer to the glass of the door.
Is there an existing sensor, or some method that you might recommend to sense the status of the door lock? Visually unobtrusive solutions are better here.
I have thought I might use a regular door/window magnetic sensor and apply it to the handle and frame, to sense the change in distance of the handle to the door when it folds in? But I’m not sure those door sensors are able to be adjusted for the small difference in distance needed here.
Perhaps there is a small rotation/orientation sensor I don’t know about (maybe a compass-type sensor?) that could determine the rotation of the handle? (I have an extra Aqara vibration sensor that says it does axis readings too… I’m not sure if that means what I think it does, but maybe I can figure out something with that?) …or perhaps someone has a better idea?
I previously posted this question to the HASS Discord, but cross-posting here in case others have a better idea.
Photos attached. First is face-on to the door. 2nd is overhead view of unlocked position. 3rd is overhead, but locked:
As I know there is no possibility to do so unless you are using property door handle. Usually working over z-wave and cost 100 - 200+€.
But there is a thing you can do that can mimic property door handle.
You can buy a zigbee contact sensor and install it inside a frame. Check it first does it has a room for it.
Then you can buy a zigbee vibration sensor that have tilt management also installed inside door/window frame.
Both are around 5 €.
Withing ha you can write a template sensor that will detect is the door open or tilled or closed.
It can work very well but it has one disadvantage.
It can’t monitor your door handle position.
I understand. You don’t want to sense the door being closed or open, but that it is locked or unlocked.
Is the sliding door frame hollow extruded aluminium?
Are the handles made of metal or plastic?
Is the locking handle made of metal or plastic? In your opinion, could a 3D printed replacement for that moving part be substituted that could still work reliably?
Would a tiny magnet glued to the moving part be able to be hidden enough to make it invisible to a casual observer from outside? Inside?
Could you run a thin two wire cable inside or outside the door frame to the lock part?
A discrete miniature reed switch or physical microswitch may be able to be added to detect lock position. Hook that back to your automation as a position sensor.
If the wiring can be completely hidden in the door frame and the magnet in to rotating bit, you may have an elegant solution.
A Hall Effect detector with a small magnet can give you proximity values as well.
Nothing will work reliabbly.
He has only two options.
Use property handle for doors and pay for it a lot of money, or use zigbee do it your self sensors that will give him the same readings.
Well no actual the same. Zigbee sensors will give him actual state of the doors and property solutions will give him actual state of the door handle.
Choose your pick.
Looks like a door sensor will sit on the non moving part of the handle up against the door (or closer to the handle if needed). And, the magnet on the moving part of the handle with some positioning practice.
Of course, the magnet probably won’t connect to the rounded surface very well. But it does not have to be that magnet. It could be a round magnet with a hole in it that can be screwed into the handle.
If the lock is keyed externally, often there is a snib that rotates and it can all be hidden inside the door frame.
Detecting door position when left unlocked but closed is undesirable. You want to make sure it is locked, not detect when somebody opens it later.
Hard wired vs wireless - for security, the situation where a flat battery or missed packet exists is highly undesirable. It is either secure or it isn’t. No element of doubt is acceptable.
Use case scenario: Elderly dementia patient. Kids. Holiday home. A pretty good 99% guess is not good enough.
Maybe but this is not what you will get from property solutions, as i saw.
They will give you a door handle position and that is it.
They will not tell you if door is opened or closed, if the window is open closed or tillted.
Just handle position that actually doesnt mean much.
A Dremel to hollow out a tiny portion of a cast handle may not compromise structural integrity, and the magnet epoxied in and painted over would allow for a professional finish.
Of course combine it with a slide position sensor. I thought that was a given. Maybe put that inside the extruded door frame as well. Put the two in series and still only use two wires.
Look why to play 150 - 200 € plus for a door handle that will give you a handle position without knowing what is actually happening with your door or window? And this is just for a handle, not to mention everything else. As I saw it they only works on z-wave.
You can have a better and more accurate solution using zigbee spending at the most 10 € on two sensors.
But if anyone want to spend hundreds on door handle positions well be my guest.
I’m just saying that there is better diy solution that cost far less money and is far more accurate.
All very interesting discussion! (sorry it took me a while to get back to this)
Let me answer a few questions:
There is no external keyway, nor any other external way to unlock the door.
That is correct. There is already a closed/open magnetic sensor on the door.
It appears to be an aluminum extrusion, yes.
Metal
Metal, and I don’t think I would want to replace it with 3D print. It gets a lot of force applied to it.
Probably? Perhaps drilled in, as someone said elsewhere in this thread.
That is an interesting possibility. I would likely have to drill into the frame to accomplish that discretely, and there is very little space around the locking mechanism (there are two claws that expand outward from the edge of the door into a metal bracket), but perhaps possible.
I’m thinking magnetic reed switch with the magnet on the handle The device to sense it could be an esp-01. (best sensing is with the switch perpendicular to the axis of the magnet)
No matter what device you use, you’ll need power. Battery powered would require frequent changes. I use these buck converters (<220VAC input)
Your simplest solution would be to attach a door sensor to the inside of the handle so that when its in the open position its detected as unlocked and in the close position detected as close.
I use a similar solution to monitor if my front door night latch is in the lock or unlock position.
edit: I use an aqara t1 for reference and its only down to 76% battery after just over a year of usage so far.
Yes I can. Back in the day I was looking for a solution for pvc/upvc window or balcony door that will send status if it is open, closed or tilted. Then I saw that there are replacement door/window handles that you can install, screw two screws and you are done, instead of dumb handles.
But they all are working on z-wave and are quite expensive. At least that was when I look it on.
The better and cheaper approach is to use zigbee contact sensor with vibration sensor that have tilt function. If you buy small ones you can put it inside window/door frame and create template sensors for it.
And there you have it. Smart balcony door/window that it will report status if it is open, closed or tilted. No need for expensive stuff working on z-wave.
