I finally found this blog (in Russian) which explains everything in great detail: https://sprut.ai/client/blog/1302
(Use Google Translate)
A key setting is to run the container in Privileged mode.
Now everything works great and I can easily add any ZigBee device to my HA.
All you other people running ZHA with the Conbee II, how is it working for you?
I have an issue where some of (seemingly random ones) my IKEA lights will report as being off despite being on. Sometimes they change back to the correct state, and sometimes they just stay “off”. Controlling them still works fine, it’s just the status that’s wrong.
Has anyone else experienced this?
Borg my Ikea and Philips hue does that to … going crazy
Using ZHA?
Conbee2 + ZHA on rasberry 3b+
Also tested on a server using docker
Same same
Ok! Hopefully, they can fix it.
Can you report it here https://github.com/zigpy/zigpy-deconz/issues so that they know more people have this problem?
The issue isn’t the ZHA stack or the Conbee2 (AFAIK). Ikea bulbs, like Hue and older Osram bulbs, default to the ZLL Zigbee profile. This can cause issues with ZHA only cooridinators, like the Nortek and Conbee2 sticks. The base “issue” is that while ZLL and ZHA are compatible, they don’t always play nicely together when passing messages. This is usually what causes your devices to become unavailable or non-responsive to commands and status requests and can cause issues to your entire mesh.
Think of it like this; Two people are having a conversation. One of them speaks fluent English (ZHA profile devices). The other person understands and can speak English, but it isn’t their native language (ZLL profile devices). Because of this small difference in communication, messages between the two can get misinterpreted and/or lost. That’s the possibility of putting ZLL default profile bulbs on a ZHA mesh network. The basics are there, but more complex messages may (and usually do) get messed up. Another analogy would be emailing a letter to someone. You’re certain you know their address, but you have portions of it wrong (street number, zip code, misspelled street name, etc). While the letter may eventually get there, the chances of it not arriving are high because the post office doesn’t know exactly how to route it there and after a few tries just gives up.
Lastly, Ikea devices (in general) and Hue bulbs are extremely chatty on the network. This will cause messages to not be routed properly because they are either busy repeating messages for other devices on the network OR they are too busy receiving. On a pure ZLL mesh, this isn’t a problem because the profile allows for this increased communication without any additional overhead. On a ZHA mesh, this causes issues because the devices need to make a decision on every message regarding encryption (ZLL requires encryption while ZHA does not) and message formatting in order to be ZHA compliant.
tl;dr: Keep ZLL devices (like Ikea, Hue, and Osram devices) on a dedicated ZLL profile hub. From the original post, it sounds like you are having repeating issues due to mixing ZLL devices on a ZHA coordinator (the Conbee2). Personally, I’d get a Hue hub and host your Ikea bulbs there and then integrate that into HA.
Source: https://www.silabs.com/documents/public/user-guides/ug103-09-fundamentals-zll.pdf (particuallry section 3, ZLL and non-ZLL devices).
2 Likes
Ok. I have never heard about that before. I have had both the Hue hub and the IKEA hub. The whole point of getting a generic zigbee usb stick and use ZHA was to use one solution for all different zigbee devices.
I currently have no other issues with my zigbee solution than the incorrect status reports of lights.
I know it from experience. 
I’ve been trying to perfect my Zigbee mesh for the better part of 6 years now.
I did the same with my Nortek stick when I first got it. My house is fairly small (1150 sq ft) and at first it was status not being received properly. Then dropping devices and then my whole mesh went off the rails (sensors not responding, locks not responding, delayed messages when sending commands, etc). It wasn’t until I actually sat down and started reading the Zigbee spec docs that I understood where the issues were. I currently have ~10 Ikea bulbs, 7 Hue bulbs and some Gledopto outside floods alongside ~25 Sengled bulbs, along with various motion, contact, and moisture sensors as well. When I had all of them on my Nortek stick, I had issues. When I put the Ikea, Hue and Gledopto bulbs back on my Hue hub, my mesh healed itself and has been rock solid ever since; No incorrect statuses and none of my devices have dropped off (aside from dead batteries lol).
1 Like
Ok, I believe you! I haven’t seen this mentioned anywhere in the HA docs about ZHA, or perhaps I just haven’t read carefully enough.
Is it impossible to work around the problem in the deconz/HA code? In theory I mean.
Most documentation doesn’t go into this kind of detail which, while I understand why, doesn’t help people who run into issues like this. I only know it because I’ve been researching this for years.
Impossible? Possibly. We are talking about core profile differences in the Zigbee protocol. While changes can be made at the software/firmware level, that’s not going to change the default behavior between ZLL and ZHA devices. The Zigbee 3.0 spec does address some of these things, but that requires firmware changes on both the coordinator (Conbee2/Nortek/Raspbee, etc) and also the devices themselves. I know that Ikea and Hue both have been steadily updating their devices with Zigbee 3.0 support, but I’m not sure on the coordinator side what (if any) progress has been made. I know for a fact that Hue in particular has made a lot of changes to their hub to support Zigbee 3.0. Ikea, last I saw, was planning on a Zigbee 3.0 rollout for their gateway in Q1/Q2 of 2019. I don’t know if that rollout ever happened though.
Here’s a white paper detailing the Zigbee 3.0 changes (worth the read, imho):
1 Like
But what I don’t understand is, based on your description of the problem, who will NOT run into these issues if they use a generic zigbee usb stick and ZHA? People that do not use IKEA or Hue lights? Those are two of the biggest suppliers of zigbee stuff that people use.
To me, it seems as if this would sort of make the whole implementation of ZHA in HA pretty useless.
2 Likes
In a simple nutshell, people who avoid mixing ZLL and ZHA devices on the same mesh shouldn’t see these kinds of issues (repeating issues aside). There’s also a lot of speculation that people who do run a mixed environment use a LOT of repeater devices and this also helps with stability (which is actually true; More repeaters means less of a chance for a ZLL device to miss a message). It’s basically an effort to “drown” out the noisy bulb repeaters and force the coordinator and repeaters to use other “real” repeaters as neighbors instead of the bulbs. This is the approach I take and it works very well, even though I don’t have any ZLL devices on my mesh.
While Hue and Ikea do produce a LOT of devices, I wouldn’t say they are the biggest suppliers when it comes to Zigbee devices. Sengled (which is my preferred bulb of choice because they specifically do not repeat messages) has a large market share as does Zemismart (they are growing in popularity lately). There’s also Innr who are making some big strides in the market as well. Other non-Zigbee bulbs are also very prevalent (Yeelight, Tuya based lights, etc).
I disagree. Lighting is only a portion of the ZHA platform. For instance, I have about 15 motion sensors (mostly SmartThings, but also a couple of Zooz 4-in-1s and I think I still have one Aeotec hanging around somewhere), around 20 contact sensors (again, various brands) and 10 water leak sensors. These all work flawlessly as they are ZHA profile devices. With that said, there are some devices coming out that are ZLL profile devices, meaning they are meant to operate in the Ikea/Hue world. Ikea has had their outlets and repeaters for awhile (and those are actually ZHA devices). Hue is working with a couple of companies on further expanding their plugs and sensors with ZLL support.
Without ZHA in HA, I wouldn’t be able to have the smart home that I have today.
Ah, I misunderstood you there. It’s only lights that are problematic, then it makes more sense.
Unfortunately I had problems with the IKEA Trådfri integration before switching to ZHA. So I don’t know if will actually be better.
1 Like
I’ve heard that before and to be honest, I have an Ikea gateway for the simple reason of being able to update firmware on my Ikea bulbs. In contrast, my Hue hub has been pretty flawless and supports more bulb manufacturers.
You might want to examine a bit higher in the topology to figure out if you have a problem with interference and/or lack of repeaters. Specifically look at your Zigbee channels and your 2.4ghz WiFi channels. Also, look at where you are placing your hub(s). Ideally, you want your Ikea/Hue/ZHA stick/hub placed as far as possible from your WiFi router as possible and have them as separated as you can channel-wise.
Yeah, they are as separated as they can be, both physically and channel-wise. Thank you for your suggestions!
1 Like
But the solution you propose, to use the Hue hub, will prohibit me from using e.g. Aqara devices?
You would then have two hubs, the hue hub for the ZLL devices and the ConBee for ZHA devices.
Sure, but that’s what I had before, using all the different brand’s own hubs, and what I wanted to get away from. ZHA seemed brilliant, and also gives me one mesh instead of 2-3 different ones.
Sorry to butt in, but what exactly do you mean by a “ZHA-Device” ?
ZLL means “Zigbee Light Link” which is a protocol (subset of Zigbee 3.0), and thus a “ZLL Device” is a zigbee device designed to only support (use) the ZLL protocol (right?)
But ZHA means “Zigbee Home Assistant” and as far as I know, this is not the name of a new and andvanced Zigbee protocol, but simply just a practical alias for an integration platform in HA (right?)
So, (assuming that I’m right) - there is no such thing as a “ZHA Device”. No manufacturer has ever made a Zigbee device that is factory aware of Home Assistant (ZHA)?
So, I presume what you mean by this term is just a reference to a device that has been paired with and has acknowledged ZHA as its coordinator, right?
I mean, as an example; a zigbee device paired with an IKEA hub doesn’t thereby magically become an IKEA Device? My Namron Zigbee light switches remain Namron’s whether they are paird with ZHA or IKEA or Phillips gateways, right?
Please feel free to correct me if I’m wrong - fully or partly.
Then (unless I’m wrong), what’s my point? Well, my point is that newbees (like myself) are getting increasingly confused by the days, as I read all these forum posts (attempting to learn), where people (experts and wannabe’s alike) constantly make up new abbreviasjons and terms right out of thin air.
Consistency and accountability is evaporating as a result of such bad habits. People end up spending more time clearing up unfortunate misunderstandings among each other, instead of solving real life problems.
Well, maybe I’m wrong. It’s late. Please excuse me. My intention was not to point fingers in any particular direction. Just a general sigh. Your contributions here in this forum is unquestionable! I wish I had just a fraction of your knowledge about Automation. Good Night.
2 Likes