Hi all,
I’ve been struggling with Z-Wave device support with Home Assistant since I first started using it over a year ago.
Recently I started using a Xiaomi gateway for a few devices, and I’ve found it to be a great way to externalise device support and take away some of the headaches of HA-tied device support. I use HA for my automations, UI and as a central platform to make everything work together.
Now I’m looking to externalise my Z-Wave devices to an external local hub, so that it’s not directly tied to my Home Assistant Pi3.
I’m wondering what solutions:
hubs/systems others have used (Eg: SmartThings, Domoticz, etc)?
what has the best device support (Eg: COMMAND_SCALL_CENTRAL_SCENE)?
what external hubs/systems have best HA integration (Eg: Xiaomi Gateway has a great integration)?
The plan is to keep it all local, not some cloud-dependant hub.
I can list out the Z-Wave devices I use if requested.
Personally I use a VeraPlus. It doesn’t rely on the internet to function and the integration with Home Assistant works well. I use my Vera purely as a Z-Wave hub and use Home Assistant for my automations.
@NotoriousBDG How is your experience been with VeraPlus? I did consider getting a Vera at one point. I’m interested to know: Do you have a recent model? Do you have many Z-Wave devices? Do you use any exotic Z-Wave hardware with your VeraPlus?
@dap35 yeah, I’m expecting that to be the case. I’m hoping that some hubs have a cloud component but will still operate offline. SmartThings comes to mind, I’m not sure if it works like that.
I came from SmartThings. I was constantly frustrated by the huge latency, lack of stability, and overall unreliability. On a good day, automations would work and have a reasonable-ish latency about 90% of the time. The entire experience was very frustrating because there was always something that didn’t work right. The amount of babysitting it took to keep SmartThings running reliably was just way too much for me.
Since switching to Home Assistant with VeraPlus controller, it’s been well over 99% reliability. Latency is significantly lower than even my best day with SmartThings. My biggest gripes with Vera is the UI is atrocious and creating complex automations can very complex. Luckily neither of those matter much to me because I’m using Home Assistant for automations.
I used to run all zwave aeotec z-stick, however i have had to many problems with it. Mainly due to the amount of zwave devices I use. The start-up of the system was super slow and seams that if i re-stared before it was fully up it could cause problems.
So I have moved over to using VeraPlus for most of the z-wave devices. This works great!
Few notes tho:
1 the delay when receiving changes from the Vera is slower then running the zwave stick. So i have moved back all my motion detectors to the zwave stick on the PI. it’s not much slower but when entering a room and light takes slightly longer time to turn on is noticeable
(when executing from automations or via interface to the Veraplus its superfast, no difference to local zwave stick)
2 Vera have a strange way of grouping stuff together to one device. So for example if you have a zwave plug that you can turn on and off, but also maybe it measures consumption. It will group this as one device with a sensor attribute.
You will only get one device in Homeassistent that have attribute with the consumption. So if you want to have a standalone sensor visible for the consumption you have to create a sensor template for it.
I also have an Air quality device that one the PI shows C02, temp and humidity. I could only get Vera to show C02 so i moved that back to.
Also Vera seams sometimes not to pick up all attributes that a device can have. I have added a few devices that so far have not been able to show the total kwh on. the W is fine tho.
All in all, iam happy, however i still run some devices on one zwave network on the PI and then a one on external Veraplus.
So before you decide to buy one, checkout how the vera will work with your current Zwave devices.
I had a Vera3 for a fair while but had nothing but problems with it (constantly crashing). It is now waiting to be thrown in the bin! Vera tech support were relatively good but never managed to fully fix my problems. I now use an Aeotec stick in my RPi3 and it seems to be sweet (I do only have 6 z-wave devices at the moment, with another 5 or so to come online soon).
Another +1 for Vera. I have the VeraEdge and it has worked very well with HASS. @nsim has a pretty good summary of how the Vera works. Vera firmware updates usually add support for new devices and better support for existing devices. But it cannot be pointed out enough how much the interface sucks. Vera firmwares seem to be more misses than hits for stability so keep an eye on the release notes before updating.
Well, I purchased a VeraPlus controller from Amazon and, following the advice here, I have been playing with it for the last month. Like @NotoriousBDG I’m using it (currently) for purely device hosting, and all automation are with within HA, and I’m not planning to change that setup. The Vera UI is… functional.
As it is, I’m MUCH HAPPIER with the responsiveness and general performance of my z-wave devices on the VeraPlus. It’s like night and day, a ways better than the Aeotec stick. The device support is also much better, as devices that I struggled getting recognised (Looking at you, CENTRAL_SCENE, The Button and POPP lock controller) are fully working out of the box.
I’ve migrated all of my plugged-in/hardwired devices like smart plugs and in-wall light switches to the Vera, and I’ve seen both networks increase in performance. I guess my setup is like @nsim noted, all my sensors still on z-wave stick. I wonder how total performance would be with all devices on the VeraPlus.
That said, I’ve noticed the Vera groupings of devices mentioned by @nsim, and I’d like to find out more about making sensor templates. Ideally I’d like to move everything off the USB stick if possible.
Does anyone have time to post any examples of how you implemented this?
Also, I tried to update the firmware, didn’t work when I tried so I left it alone.
That’s interesting. I threw my Vera3 out because it was so unreliable. Having switched to a Aeotec stick I have had a rock solid z-wave network. Adding nodes is far easier and they all work perfectly with HA. I would never go back to Vera now. Plus the Aeotec stick is cheaper here in Aus.
Worth noting that the VeraPlus is not the Vera3, seems like VeraPlus is more recent.
Maybe some difference there.
I’ve found adding devices much easier with this VeraPlus, and it has recognised everything first time, every time… Which was not the experience I had with the Aeotec stick + HA.
To be clear though, I’d be interested to know if you have any exotic z-wave hardware, or anything that uses scenes (aka COMMAND_CALL_CENTRAL_SCENE)? I’ve had nightmares trying to get some things to work, working with developers in this forum and on GitHub, running beta builds of OpenZWave, to no avail.
CENTRAL_SCENE is still not supported to this day, btw.
that’s right, the Vera3 is older than the Vera Plus however when I was on the forums trying to get my Vera3 working (as well as getting help from Vera tech support) I was noticing a pretty strong pattern of people having troubles with all Vera hardware.
That’s cool, your experience is different from mine. Maybe Vera is improved on that front, I hope they have and continue to.
As it is now, my system runs better, more responsive and I haven’t had a single crash or from the VeraPlus controller. It survives network issues very well from what I can see, and recognises all of my z-wave hardware first time. I haven’t tried anything zigbee yet. The Vera interface I think is functional, but I can see why it’s not to everybody’s taste.
As with anything here, your mileage may (and will) vary, as there are many variables involved.
I’m still interested to know what kind of z-wave hardware you use @sparkydave, and if you use any exotic kit.
I personally had the most trouble with my Fibaro FGPB101 Button and POPP 012501 door strike controller with HA, as well as some Vision Door/Window sensors. Also, the last straw was repeatedly trying to get a pair of Fibaro FGD212 dimmers to be recognised. If you’re interested, you’ll find my various adventures around this forum, or through my post history.
Those struggles lasted so long, that I started looking at different solutions. Eventually I tried some externally managed Xiaomi kit, which works amazingly, and it got my thinking to externalise my z-wave. So far, this has worked out to be a great choice.
@plonka2000 I am not really happy with my z-stick, I think because of location restrictions, and I’ve been considering setting up a VeraPlus, which is small, and link it to HA.
It seems like you’ve had a good experience. How is the lag with your z-wave devices? I’ve read on other posts that the lag can be noticable.
