i just sent you the information
Ugh. I gotta start getting notifications for the forums. My apologies @tylas13 . Whatâs the update youâre hoping for here?
This is a really interesting product. I am thinking about getting a plugin EV with V2H, so a panel upgrade might be a good thing to do at the same time. However, I will not include a SPAN panel as part of it unless I have complete local control. This is not about some ideological issue with me - I work in communications and software engineering and am totally comfortable with cloud services.
The reason I will not buy a SPAN without local control is that I want to assure the ability to use the panel and not have to rip it out if you guys shut down. One of the challenges with startups is that economic conditions change and financing ability changes. This means companies can end up closing shop, and there is no way to guarantee services will live on.
This is not just an issue with small companies - large companies like Google sunset products all the time, and if you are depending on that product, you may have to scramble to find alternatives. Dumping small smart speakers is one thing, but a 20 yr+ investment in the electrical panel that your home depends on is a completely different issue!
Local control means I have the ability to continue using the product even if you guys disappear as a company. I hope that doesnât happen of course, but local control is a hedge that I think any consumer wiring such a big check will want. And you should fully support that and market that fact because I think it makes an investment in your product much more durable than any corporate commitment can be.
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Hi @gdgib, I was just describing the HACS enrollment for your Span integration. If you do happen to update it HACS will automatically let you know if itâs loaded there. More of an âin generalâ guide.
That being said, I was wondering if you have control issues with your breakers in HA? They alway show on, and when toggled it shows it going off for a second and then goes back to an on state. The breaker does not turn off at all. Checking the logs I get this:
Logger: frontend.js.latest.202303091
Source: components/system_log/__init__.py:254
First occurred: 8:32:28 PM (1 occurrences)
Last logged: 8:32:28 PM
:0:0 Script error.
@fresnoboy I would seriously consider waiting unless you need to do the panel upgrade immediately. While SPAN has been good about making promises regarding features, they have been very slow to deliver. The product is promising, but the company does not provide any information about the panel to end users, only to their approved installers. They have made it clear that they do not announce timelines, and firmware releases are secretive, coming automatically and the without user approval.
There is currently NO real capability to run this panel 100% locally. Current integrations are very buggy, and future unannounced firmware updates will likely cause chaos.
Also, customer service is completely useless. Donât even bother calling them, as you wonât get anyone that has any understanding of the product.
Now, this may change. Although all weâve heard from SPAN so far is âbe patient, weâre new hereâ and absolutely zero evidence that any suggestions that have been made will ever be included. The best choice at this time would be to wait until the company has demonstrated a willingness to respond to customer requests.
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Well, that doesnât sound good. Unfortunately timing is usually based on when you acquire a vehicle. I wonât be able to get delivery for awhile, so I can wait a bit. For the reasons I mentioned, local control is quite important to me. So Iâll keep an eye on the forum while I wait for a vehicle to be available to buy!
thx
mike
Finally got the integration working. And got the data hooked up to the Sankey chart card. Pretty awesome. Ordered some more single outlet energy monitors to split out downstream power draw.
Now just waiting for my solar to be activated and batteries installed.
Yeah I hear that for sure. When I purchased the panel I didnât realize (or wasnât told/didnât read anything that says) that I canât manage the panel myself. The installer accidentally added himself to my account, I canât remove him. Some of the breakers have incorrect amperage, I canât adjust that. If I install a new breaker and run a new line, I canât add it to the system. I donât want to have to call the solar installer or find an electrician that is certified with SPAN every time I want to make an adjustment. SPAN wonât do it themselves - itâs actually pretty frustrating. Iâm not going to go through the process of getting an electricians license in my state because that means I would need to quit my job and put in the 4000 hours they require. Some states donât even have those requirements - like Louisiana - they just require that you are worth $10k (Iâm assuming so you can pay for anything you f- up).
Anyway, I could go on - and at some point I will actually put up a fight (legally if necessary) if these things donât change.
The Right to Repair movement seems relevant here. Right to repair - Wikipedia
And as a company based in California, itâs logical that they would have to conform to any laws passed in their state of incorporation. California â Right to Repair
A program to certify homeowners would certainly be welcomed. Even if itâs not free. That way we could help each other out.
@SPAN-Colin
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Have you tried to get Span to change and update your breaker settings? During the install process when I had the master electrician here he had to call Span to get it enrolled. We asked how the process worked and later verified with their pretty primitive technical support that they can update our panel settings in the app if we give them the information.
I have a couple chances that need to be made on my panel, a couple of double pole 240V breakers were installed that should be single. If this isnât possible to get Span to do without a certified Span electrician do then this breaks one of the primary functions of having this installed in the first place.
I will put this on my task list to update my panel breakers this weekend and attempt a change by contacting Span and report back here.
We should have the ability to change this ourselves, but I also see the need on some sort of verification system. Maybe hire the guy that made the AR guide on the UniFi app so we can see the breakers and lines and verify breaker size at the same time.
Yeah, looks like breaker control is broken for me too. Iâll look into this over the next or two. I assume itâs something a little silly.
Thanks for reminding me about the HACS registration. Iâll go through that when I get the controls working again.
FWIW, contributions to GitHub - gdgib/span-hacs are welcome if anyone wants to help me improve the documentation or add any of the useful bits from this thread. I definitely wonât have time to do it all, but know Iâm the kind of person who is more likely to improve and accept your PR than reject it.
BTW, I opened up issues: Issues ¡ gdgib/span-hacs (github.com)
Iâll try and get the breaker controls working in the next two weeks, and Iâm starting to work on getting this added to HACS properly.
Yup. Local control is important, and this is one of the most important reasons why. Youâve articulated one of the biggest benefits (from a sales point of view) of building more/better local control functionality. Itâs also one of the reasons that the Matter spec is built around local, manufacturer-independent control. Matter does not (yet) have support for energy monitoring or similar functionality, but itâs got great promise so far, although implementation will take time.
Iâm getting my span panel installed this week, and one of the first things Iâm going to do is test drive the HACS integration myself.
You might want to get in touch with Jeff on this branch, he has been pretty active on trying to implement the durable authentication into the integration:
With both improvements going into the same integration it may fix most of the issues we are seeing.
For HACS, here are the general guidelines below. I am not a lot of help on the coding side, but I can help on the front end to get the integration in HACS:
@j4ys0n @tylas13
Initial system commissioning must be completed by a certified installer, but you can absolutely contact our Support team to have your breaker configurations updated if you have circuits added by a non-certified installer or if something is labelled incorrectly. You can also ask them to remove an unwanted user from your panel. See support article with details here.
This is not the first Iâve heard this feedback, that you want to be able to make these changes yourselves as Panel owners. I donât have anything to announce, but it is something we are considering.
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Came here from a (Twitter) SPAN DM thread suggestion; Iâve been trying to get into any beta of the local API since before I had my two SPAN panels installed â spoke at length with the sales rep and had him double check a few things internally before signing up for the install.
While Iâm not (currently) a Home-Assistant user, I did want to add my voice to the âwe as homeowners want to be able to make circuit additions/removals/modifications ourselvesâ group. Itâd be a very nice quality of life improvement. Sure, can SPAN support (or your installer) update things for you?
Yes, but whatâs the advantage? Plus, thereâs the delay of having to reach out, get a response, make sure everyone is clear which circuits get what amps and are labeled as XYZ, etc.
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I suspect it discourages casual changes by adding friction to the transaction. There is probably an assumption that users are fundamentally poorly equipped to do the right things here and need some mothering to prevent them from getting themselves into trouble. This may be especially true for systems that may be poorly documented or have configurations that could cause damage and the company doesnât want to be liable for that.
Perhaps the right answer is for a self certification that gives access to training info and waives holding the company responsible for any liabaility?
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If that is SPANâs thinking, that type of approach doesnât really hold any water. As someone else stated earlier, once the panel is commissioned, it no longer should take SPAN-certified anything to do basic circuit maintenance.
The entire product category of panel boards, other than products like SPANâs, is homeowner serviceable when it comes to labeling circuits. I can modify the labels on existing circuits in the SPAN app. So it should follow that I can add / remove / update Amps of existing circuits in the app.
Adding / removing / modifying circuits is, I know, a more contentious subject â but regardless of if a homeowner hires an electrician or does work themselves (depending on location and regulations), it should not take communication with a short list of people (SPAN or the people theyâve certified) to create / remove / modify circuits in the software, since the breakers physically work upon plugging in. (One could even make the argument that it is unsafe to have physically working breakers unlabeled and not present in the softwareâŚ)
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Is the SPAN panel internal webpage displaying the the circuits? ( ip_address//#/circuits ) The System and Energy pages work, but the Circuits do not display any information. I am not currently using Home Assistant.
Firmware Version spanos2/r202311/04
The SPAN panel app works but not the internal webpage.
Thanks for any information.
Joe, this is a problem that Iâve seen before, and a couple of other people on this discussion thread have also dealt with. It caused me problems for months before it suddenly started working correctly. That seems to be the resolution for everyone else who has had the problem. This is not a new problem, and it persists throughout firmware updates. I started commenting about this very problem back in July of last year on this thread, roll back to my early posts to review.
Unfortunately, as a side effect of this problem, the Home Assistant integration wonât work for you either.
It may be a problem with the way your system was provisioned, but there is no way of knowing. Tech support at SPAN wonât help you because the local control website and API are not âofficiallyâ supported.
This will likely not be fixed any time soon.