Why are people asking the same questions over and over again? (Or the Regulars' Chatroom) 🤷

Social
193

It worked!1!!!1!!

194

Wrong topic, maybe?

195

Saw this post from Tom

" You should read this advice about avoiding device ids too: Why and how to avoid device_ids in automations and scripts"

If that’s the advice why then does the automation editor make it soooo easy to do the wrong thing?

2 Likes
196

More than that. It’s a “great way to start”, apparently. :roll_eyes:

3 Likes
197

Because the ‘D’ comes before the ‘E’ :thinking:

198

That REALLY sucs, but that’s not the worst of it…

You know there are entity_id’s (traditional), but now there are entity_id’s that are connected to Device_id’s that are the different but the same in theory. There are also entry_id’s that have something to do with entity_id’s naming, unique_id, or some mix of the 2. I don’t know but I suspect entry_id’s are connected to both flavors or entity_id’s which we are supposed to pretend are only 1 flavor but are not.

Be wary wary careful if it’s an entity_id or an entry_id.

Use names in automations/scripts for device/entity ID.

So why are device_id’s favored? Because the architecture team wants them to be favored.

I think there’s an FR to not have the device stuff favored and first on the list of options, but I couldn’t find it.

2 Likes
199

Ranting here because this seems to be the direction this thread is headed.

I still can’t understand the switch to “friendly” names in automations.

I mean - we’re all used to referring to triggers, conditions and actions. They’re even right there in the yaml, but if you post an automation for anyone to use, now your brain needs to map trigger, condition and action to “When”, “And if” and “Then Do” respectively.

It’s confusing enough for those who are used to the Front end matching the code. I honestly doubt it’ll help anyone who is just starting out and has been given a yaml file to work with.

1 Like
200

I think it was a good “attempt” to help “beginners”, Howvere they should have kept, the ( Trigger / Condition / Action ) in parentheses , so Beginners learn what it means, instead of trying to “invent a new formula” , which doesn’t exist outside HA UI

EDIT: Well it’s actually there, below, i just noticed :laughing:

However a Trigger can be both When/If, a Condition can also be And IF/When , And it get even worse when people comes to Action ( IF / When )

" If/when " motion is detected , “when/if” it’s dark outside, i want the the light to turn on, but only “if/When” there is someone home "

“If/when” Someone is Home, i want the light to turn on, “When/if” motion is detected, and only “if/when” it’s dark outside

“If/when” it’s dark outside , i want the light to turn on, “if/when” someone is home, And “if/when” motion is detected

A Very common Question, which can “variate” depending upon peoples mind, and the “preferences”

201

Device should go in “Other Triggers” . :confounded:

3 Likes
202

Device should go under “R”, for recycle bin. It’s one thing to make stuff simplified for beginners (who still won’t read the docs) - it’s another matter entirely when you alienate or confuse most of your existing userbase in order to cater for the lowest denominator.

I’ve said this to myself over the past year - “HA is prioritizing accessibility to my family members who still have no idea how it all works, while at the same time doing its best to complicate stuff for me, the main user”

Rant over.

3 Likes
203

It doesn’t help that the device concept is extremely fuzzy.

When I select Device to make a trigger in the UI, the first item in the dropdown list is ZHA Toolkit (it comes first because there’s a symbol at the beginning of the name). Next is Alarmo, which is, I suppose, a virtual device created by an integration. Next we have ArgonOne, which is an add-on, followed by Average Sensor, which is a HACS integration.

You can now create your own devices and put any entities you like into them (Device Tools from HACS).

This is supposed to be easier?

204

I hate this as well, but as someone that doesn’t use the ui very often it’s not horrible. I say that because I have interacted with people that this ‘plain’ language has helped them get passed that first barrier, so I ill give that slack.

205

My go to has always been the UI first and foremost. It allows me to gauge how really user friendly HA is while showing me everything on (mostly) a single screen without having to keep track of indentations.

I’ve occasionally been switching to yaml whenever there’s any duplicate stuff within the automation (copy & paste is much easier there), and the context switch is really jarring, at least to me personally.

206

My youngest family member is 3 :thinking:
:rofl:

1 Like
207

Feels like we’re getting more and more closer to that Age-Group, with humongous Buttons, Default huge “Paddings / gaps”, Filling up with 50% white-space
Well, i guess i will benefit from from this , when i reach the age of 99, needs +7 Glasses, and have beginning parkinson’s disease

208

To go back to the original post (sort of)…

One reason why people often ask the same question is because the answers they are getting are to slightly different questions.

There was an example this morning. A newcomer to HA had two sensible queries:

  • Are PIR motion sensors reliable in the kitchen, where there are multiple heat sources?
  • How do I manage turning off the lights.

The answers were “Yes” and “Look at this cookbook post”, but the thread quickly morphed into a discussion of hardware.

There’s nothing wrong with this - the author of the post got the answers he wanted (not the right ones IMHO, but still…) and useful information was exchanged - but it does highlight how inefficient forums are as a reference source.

They’re more like a sea you have to swim in for a while to get your bearings.

1 Like
209

We have a guide for asking questions. Perhaps we need a guide for answering questions?

2 Likes
210

The #1 rule is don’t use AI.
#2 don’t recommend a YT video unless you have watched it yourself recently and know it’s correct.
(Especially that one Chris just did calling everything in HACS Add-ons…)
#3 If you don’t know the answer tell the OP it’s your best guess, may want more input.

2 Likes
211

:rofl:

212

I try to make it a habit to state when something is my opinion or I’m not completely sure for the very reason that I don’t want someone to come back and say “but Bill said it’s true!!!”

But I’d like to add a #4: When you’re wrong, change your post to include that you were wrong. For a long time, I’ve seen people say something completely wrong, get called out on it, and then be like “what? I never said that!!!”. Speaking from experience, it just happened to me just the other day. lol

2 Likes