So it seems I forgot one of my smart home use cases, and have just realised I need a TBR that isn’t a smart display/speaker.
Ideally I’d like PoE for flexibility of placement, but this isn’t a deal breaker.
That I’m aware of I have the following options:
Any of the SMLight SMHubs which actually run OTBR (Nano/Ultima)
** Though I assume not the SMLight SLZB series to avoid Serial over IP (or have I misunderstood the difference?).
GL.iNet GL-S20
GL.iNet GL-S200 (not PoE)
IKEA DIRIGERA (not PoE)
Connect ZBT-2 (USB only)
Are there any I’m missing, and/or should be prioritising/avoiding?
I purchased the Aqara M100 thread border router about 3 weeks ago and it has been rock solid so far. I took a chance because only Aqara’s M3 hub shows on the Home Assistant certified list. However the M100 is way cheaper and the 20 thread device maximum was not an issue for me. I needed the Aqara app to get the M100 hub onto the wifi, firmware updated and added to HA, but after that only HA was needed to connect thread devices. So far I have added 4 IKEA BILRESA buttons and 4 KLIPPBOK water leak sensors directly through home assistant - even IKEA firmware updates worked through HA matter integration.
Unpopular opinion around here, but IMO, PoE makes sense only for devices with very high bandwidth requirements (like cameras, or APs) whereas Thread is very low bandwidth so there is negligible chance it will saturate your WiFi network. If you have bad WiFi coverage, spend your money on a better APs, not pricey PoE ports for devices that will never use the bandwidth
Keep an eye on posts like this and this about problems with the SMHUB line. This is essentially a Pi Zero-level SBC running Linux so it’s far more complex than the esp32-based GL-S20 which runs embedded FreeRTOS kernel with OTBR. I’m sure SMHUB will get the issues worked out, but the GL-iNet will always be a simpler architecture to maintain — and both are far simpler than trying to run OTBR yourself.
If you don’t already have WiFi 6, my initial recommendation is to upgrade to a WiFi 6 (or better) router with integrated TBR, such as Eero 6 or later. The improvement over WiFi 5 is substantial, and the rest of your network will thank you. These are under $62 (renewed) currently on Amazon and, unlike some other vendors, actually shows you your Thread credentials TLV dataset in their app.
I got the Home Assistant ZBT-2 and its been working well for me, think its around $40. Can also be used as a zigbee router if you’d like, just not at the same time.
You generally got the idea good, that you should hardwire the thread border routers if possible. Wifi just adds another layer of uncontrolled delay, avoid it if possible.
The second point you should think about is support. Thread is constantly evolving, and you need support from the vendor to keep it up to date. Currently zbt-1/zbt-2 is on old thread version (2022 july), the peeps at nabu casa forgot that it’s not enough just to sell the hardware. Eventually it will get updates, but it’s a shame imo. gl-inet is on old version as well, and i personally do not expect anything from them. Ikea hub is up to date, and i expect it will get support for a long time. I can’t comment on smlight stuff.
And about poe, it’s just a convenient way of powering stuff. It’s good if you want to place the device in a spot, that has no outlets nearby, or if you just want to simplify the cabling.
I’m more concerned with P than E; where I would like to put the device for best coverage is nowhere near the HASS box, and isn’t ideal to try to get a mains power connection to it. However, I can get a 24W PoE injector from Amazon for ~£12, and that’s good for 100m of cable if I need it.
Wifi coverage isn’t an issue; the router is already WiFi-6 enabled.
Very good point about the support. IKEA will definitely keep their kit updated, but now you mention it, I have a feeling they were only going to focus on implementing the bits of Thread that their devices need; so if it’s a not a feature/function that IKEA sell it’s unlikely to be supported in future.
The Aqara M3/M200 do look good, they are PoE capable, will probably get updates, but they seem to be overkill for what I need and I’m hesitant to have to use yet another app just to get a TBR running.
I’ll have to keep digging about the SMLight options and how well they’re updated.
Thread is the networking layer, a thread border router doesn’t care about device type. You should not confuse a thread border router (as a service) and a matter controller (as a service). You specifically asked about border routers. You could have 5 IKEA dirigeras plugged in, all 5 would be border routers, but only one would run the matter controller.
Nowdays vendors ship devices that can run both of these. Do you need a matter controller as well? HA could be user as matter controller without any issues with any external thread border router.
Fair point, yes - The confusion is mine.
Right now I have a feeling that my Nest Hub Max is both TBR and Matter controller, but I have need to semi-frequently turn it off, thus rendering the Thread-based Matter devices (I have a handful on wifi also) uncontactable. So looking for a replacement device that isn’t a smart speaker/display/multi-function device.
@peterxian: - I have a couple different reasons for using POE:
Battery maintenance: I’m now running 80+ devices on the premises for which I need to track battery status. And occasionally replace some that are in hard-to-access locations. And I’ve even found that some devices can get moved around, and un-findable after their battery expires. None of that is an issue with wired connections.
Security: I will NOT put security cameras on wi-fi. Do you know how easily jammable that is?
And yeah, the dedicated bandwidth on a wire is nice, with no interference to worry about.
I would avoid running serial over IP as a way to remote the Thread antennae/chip-set from the box running HA. HA runs most of the Thread stack, whereas the antennae/chip-set is moving frames to/from the Thread wireless side (this is an overly simplified explanation), and there can possibly be time sensitivities (jitter/delay) between the two (this is not the case for say ZWave where the ZWave stack runs on the antennae/chip-set). Having said that, many people run this type of setup sucessfully.
I would avoid using WiFi for the LAN side of the TBR. IMHO its more about the higher probability of a packet drop, and this also means TREL is running over WiFi which makes the Thread mesh a bit more vulnerable. Again this is not that much of an issue as things can work in general. In addition, If one is also trying to remote their antennae/chip-set over WiFi I think should be even more avoided as it likely makes the jitter/delay even worse.
Then you’re fine with basically any TBR, it does not have to be running on home assistant, and it’s not really needed to use the matter fabric/controller it provides. Ikea dirigera, aqara m200, etc… I personally don’t like aqara. But as you must see by now, there is no “perfect” choice here. You have to give up something, you just need to decide what is the most important for you, and which vendor you trust.
I am exploring the Matter over Thread topic as well. I am running a virtual machine for HA. I could configure a usb device with my server, but the possition of it is not good, so I decided to go with a device in my LAN. I do not rely on PoE.
My goal would be to integrate new sensors, especially those from IKEA, to fill some gaps, like air quality, window detection etc.
Currently I am running with a GL-S20. I currently have following issues and observations, I would like to share:
Thread devices loose the connection with GL-S20
Home Assistant looses the connection to GL-S20
Lost connections could be repaired with random reboots in no reproduceable order
Home Assistant and GL-S20 must be in the same subnet/VLAN
Home Assistant and GL-S20 are not able to communicate, when there is IPv6 on that subnet
The GL-S20 Firmware is still Beta 1 - communication is bad
GL-S20 with online firmware update broke the system; a manual re-flash was necessary
GL-S20 prefers its Matter address for communication (gl-s20-otbr.local) and had trouble with my lan network dns - it is a public domain like home.example.com
Some of my problems might be based on my - lets say - advanced network (domain + IPv6) but I have also seen a lot of people have similar setups with seperated VLANs and home assistant. My idea was to have HA in my server lan und GL-S20 in my IOT lan, since it is the gateway for the sensors.
Since the connection is this unstable, I would like to explore other hardware before finally deciding if matter over thread is a thing for my home. Next on my list would be a smlight slzb-06m, but the one thread likes it and recommends it, other say how hard the setup is and between the lines I read similar troubles, as I see them with my GL-S20.
Is matter over thread maybe not a thing and only a good match with google or apple devices? I dont know yet, but it feels that way actually.
As I understand it, the SLZB-06 series are effectively just acting as remote antennae, connecting to HA’s OTBR instance using serial over TCP, which is the bit that HA doesn’t recommend (and why one thread praises it, and the other says it’s complicated).
The SMHubs (and the GL-S20/S200) run OTBR on their own hardware, and then the OTBR instance talks to HA over the network in the same way a Google/Amazon device would do. My choice is probably going to be the SMHub Nano when payday rolls around.
Also worth noting that depending on exactly what IKEA devices you’re wanting to use, they’ll extend the Thread network themselves if they’re mains powered (the ALPSTUGA for example).